On the agenda

1. 1Call to Order - Roll Call▶ 0:00
2. 2

   2020 Irrigation Rate and Rate Structure Review Analysis

   discussed

   Stantec consultant Jeff Dykstra presented a high-level review of the city's irrigation rate structure, covering customer billing data, existing rate structure (customer charge, base charge, tiered volumetric charge), local benchmarking, and policy considerations. Council, particularly Deputy Mayor Starkey and Councilman Altman, expressed concerns about fairness of starting irrigation customers at Tier 3 rates and inequitable access to reclaimed water (only ~3% of connections). No formal action was taken; staff was to return with recommendations and additional data on reclaimed water availability.

   • direction:Council directed staff to provide additional information on the percentage of parcels with access to reclaimed water and to return with refined rate structure recommendations. (none)

   🏢Stantec and Associates🏢Tampa Bay Water👤Jay Myers👤Jeff Dykstra👤Jeff Starkey👤Ms. Manz👤Pete Altman👤Robert Rivera#2020 Irrigation Rate and Rate Structure Review Analysis#Gulf Harbors#North River neighborhood reclaimed water expansion#Reclaimed water program#Tiered rate structure (Tier 1, Tier 2, Tier 3)#Water Use Permit

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   [00:00:21] the City Council will be conducting its meetings through use of communications media technology [00:00:26] until further notice. The City Council Chamber will not be open to the public for these meetings. [00:00:31] During the meetings, comments may be emailed to MyersJay at CityofNewportRitchie.org or [00:00:36] you may call 1-872-240-3412, access code 606-759-949. Please keep in mind that access to the meeting [00:00:46] by phone may be limited and email access may be delayed. By waiting until the meeting to [00:00:51] make a comment, you may not be able to participate in the meeting. The City Council reserves [00:00:55] the right to proceed on any item whether public communications are delayed or otherwise obstructed. [00:01:01] So we have one discussion item, Ms. Manz, or is Ms. Rivera taking it? [00:01:06] Mr. Rivera is prepared to take the agenda item. We do have Mr. Jeff Dykstra of Stantec [00:01:16] and Associates who will also be joining us, and that is the firm that was responsible [00:01:23] for the evaluation of our communication structures. They've additionally developed some recommendations [00:01:32] to us regarding some improvements that we can make in that respect and have prepared [00:01:39] a report that determines the impact of any rate changes. With that being said, I'm going [00:01:45] to let Mr. Rivera kick it off. [00:01:49] I just want to add to what Ms. Manz has said. This is what we would consider the first step. [00:01:55] We identified the different elements from discussions that you all had previously. Jeff [00:02:02] is going to present our existing conditions when it comes to the rate structures, items [00:02:09] like water conservation, those types of things to kind of give you some insight, and then [00:02:14] he will go into letting you know the different options that we have. When he's done, I'll [00:02:20] talk a little bit more in detail when it comes to the recommendations that we're going to [00:02:27] give you as far as those options, and so that would be our request from you, is to kind [00:02:33] of either tell us that you're in agreement with all of them and to proceed, or you might [00:02:39] pick three out of five, but that would be up to you after he gives his presentation [00:02:44] and after I talk a little bit. So with that, I'll turn it over to Jeff. [00:02:48] Thanks, Robert. Can everybody hear me? [00:02:53] Yes. [00:02:54] Yes. [00:02:55] Yes. [00:02:56] Well, I appreciate the opportunity to be with you this evening, albeit under the circumstances. [00:03:03] At least I'm able to speak with you over the GoToMeeting, so we'll make the most of [00:03:09] it. As Robert introduced, we had the opportunity to perform a review of the city's irrigation [00:03:15] rate structure and just have some presentation of our findings and recommendations relative [00:03:24] to that and some ideas and some considerations for you to think about going forward. So no [00:03:29] necessary specific call to action tonight in terms of a specific rate that we're recommending [00:03:37] that you adopt, but more so just some overall policy and concepts to think about as we evaluate [00:03:45] this a little bit further relative to your overall goals as a city. [00:03:53] So with that, our scope of services was really to perform a high-level review of your irrigation [00:04:00] rate structure and rates, and we broke it up into four main components, which are summarized [00:04:06] here on the screen, but first thing we wanted to do was take a deep dive into your irrigation [00:04:11] customer billing data and see, you know, who are the customers that are using separate [00:04:16] potable irrigation meters, what are their demand characteristics on a monthly basis, [00:04:21] and just get an understanding of the customer base itself. Then we went into a diagnostic [00:04:29] review of your existing irrigation rate structure and then wanted to perform a local benchmarking [00:04:33] analysis to provide you some context and understanding of what other communities in the area are [00:04:38] doing as far as irrigation rates and rate structures. And then finally, just to provide [00:04:46] some understanding and ideas relative to rates and financial implications, if you were to [00:04:52] make several or any change to your irrigation rate structure, there are some things that [00:04:57] we need to think about that have impacts to your overall financial sustainability as a [00:05:02] utility, but also relative to your water and sewer rates as well. And in addition to that, [00:05:09] we've identified some potential policy, some options for some potential policy considerations, [00:05:16] and then also some ideas for particular, in particular customers or stakeholders concerned [00:05:23] about the overall level or rate of their irrigation bills on a monthly basis. So with that, we'll [00:05:30] jump right in. It's helpful at the outset to get some understanding and context behind [00:05:36] when we're talking about irrigation rates, what are we exactly referring to? Most people [00:05:41] will understand what irrigation is. And so that concept isn't foreign, but generally [00:05:47] speaking, utilities, from the utility perspective, have three primary options that they provide [00:05:52] irrigation demands or irrigation service to their customers. And that's outlined here [00:05:57] in this graphic, but I'll just briefly summarize them. Most of your service is provided through [00:06:04] a single domestic meter. In terms of a residential home, we'll have a one meter, and that is [00:06:11] the water used for indoor, but also for outdoor. And that also, sewer use gets, or sewer volumes [00:06:19] get measured based on the water demand from that meter. The second component on this is [00:06:25] some customers have the option to have a separate or secondary meter, and that's specifically [00:06:30] for irrigation purposes, and this is potable water as well. And then you do have some in [00:06:36] your service territory that have reclaimed water available. And so, as you can see by [00:06:40] this graph, the overwhelming number of, the overwhelming customer base uses that domestic [00:06:47] meter, if you will, to service their, any outdoor or irrigation demands that they may [00:06:52] have. And this, the availability of this, of these three options between communities [00:06:57] really varies significantly by community. But I'll say just generally speaking, this [00:07:03] type of ratio that you have is pretty consistent with what we've seen in the area, but also [00:07:09] throughout Florida. There are some communities with greater reclaimed water available, but [00:07:15] there are unique circumstances and factors that go into that availability of that particular [00:07:22] service. We should also point out that just managing irrigation demands is a really important [00:07:29] part of complying with the city's water use permit, and pricing of irrigation plays into [00:07:37] that management of the demand. And so, that's really what we're talking about today, is [00:07:41] the pricing construct for your current irrigation rates. For example, the water use permit requires [00:07:49] an inclining block rate structure, and so you have that currently in place, but that's [00:07:54] an important pricing consideration that, you know, charges higher cost for more irrigation [00:08:02] demand, and we'll go over that in a few minutes. [00:08:04] Jeff, if you'll let me just interrupt for a second. I think it's important to introduce [00:08:09] the rate structure to the council, and we have what is referred to as a three-tiered [00:08:16] system, and the first is a fixed charge if you're a customer. The second rate is based [00:08:24] on your meter size, and then the third factor is volume-based, so it's dependent on the [00:08:33] amount of water that flows through your meter. [00:08:35] Yeah, absolutely, and we have a slide, and a couple slides will go over those components. [00:08:44] And so, this particular review is really focused on that 3% there with the separate potable [00:08:51] water irrigation meters, and so that represents about 350 connections on your system, just [00:08:58] to give you some perspective on the number of customers that we're talking about. [00:09:07] So, the first thing that, one of the first things that we did was really try to understand [00:09:11] who are the customers that are using these separate potable irrigation meters. What we [00:09:16] found is that out of the 350 or so accounts, about 70% are residential, and of that 70%, [00:09:26] roughly 90% have a 5-8-inch meter. So, the overwhelming majority, your most common customer [00:09:33] with irrigation service and with your utility is a residential customer with a 5-8-inch [00:09:39] meter, and this shows that just a histogram or distribution of the bills with the count [00:09:44] of the bills on the y-axis and the monthly irrigation demand across the x-axis, but the [00:09:50] average monthly usage is, for this type of customer, is 7,000 gallons per month, and [00:09:54] that's just for the irrigation meter itself. [00:10:00] Once we understood that, we took it a step further and said, okay, well, obviously the [00:10:06] amount of irrigation demand is going to vary or you think would vary by parcel size, and [00:10:11] so we looked at the parcel sizes for each of these customers, and so this is a distribution [00:10:17] of the residential customers with a 5-8-inch meter. As you can see, 63% are at a quarter [00:10:25] acre or less, and you can see the biggest distribution there is roughly 6,000 to 9,000 [00:10:31] square feet for your typical lot size within the city service area, but you can see just [00:10:38] a...I thought this was just informative, and you can see that 87% are at a half acre or [00:10:45] less, and so you've really got a high congestion of parcel sizes that's even less than a quarter [00:10:50] of an acre, an acre, excuse me, but then with those two data points, we tried to make a [00:11:01] correlation and understand, okay, if we know who our typical customer is, we know what their [00:11:06] normal lot size is, what is the average monthly irrigation demand for these customers, and the [00:11:12] black box is really just...we highlighted the customers that are half acre or less and what [00:11:17] the average monthly demand is, and you can see just ranging with even up to a half an acre, [00:11:23] you're typically talking about anywhere from 4,000 to 8,000 or 9,000 gallons per month of [00:11:29] irrigation demand from these secondary meters, and so the average...this correlates pretty well [00:11:36] to the average that we talked about a few slides ago at 7,000 gallons per month for a typical [00:11:41] residential customer, and we'll come back to that 7,000 gallons when we do some of the [00:11:45] bill comparisons here in a few slides. Next, we did a diagnostic review or overview of your [00:11:54] existing rate structure, and so this plays into what was mentioned a few slides ago, but your rate [00:12:01] structure consists of three components, a customer charge, a base charge, and a volumetric charge. [00:12:07] The customer charge is really intended to capture any costs associated with billing, customer [00:12:12] service, meter reading, that kind of thing, and it's fixed regardless of what meter size you have, [00:12:18] and so customer with a 5.8-inch meter pays the same customer charge as a customer with a 2-inch [00:12:24] meter, as an example. The base charge is a readiness-to-serve charge, and it's scaled by [00:12:30] meter size, and so a 2-inch meter has a higher base charge than, say, a 5.8-inch meter for irrigation [00:12:36] service, and then the third component, the volumetric charge, this is a per-thousand-gallon [00:12:42] variable rate, and it's tiered, as I mentioned, and it's really linked up and tied to your water [00:12:49] rate structure. The only difference being that your irrigation rates merge the first three [00:12:56] tiers for water use and are charged at third-tier rate for all irrigation usage. [00:13:03] Jeff, this is Jeff Starkey, the Deputy Mayor. May I ask just a quick question? [00:13:08] Just to clarify what I'm saying here, with irrigation, we're automatically starting out [00:13:14] with irrigation on Tier 3, is that correct, to the people at home that may be watching? [00:13:17] That's correct, yep. [00:13:18] Okay, thank you. [00:13:20] That is correct, and the basis behind that is that if you don't have a separate irrigation meter, [00:13:28] the rate structure is established such that your Tier 1 and Tier 2 usage is really capturing [00:13:34] indoor water demands, maybe some outdoor use, but by the time you get to 10,000 gallons [00:13:41] or Tier 3, you're really talking about outdoor or irrigation discretionary usage there, [00:13:49] and so that's why the pricing is linked to that third tier for irrigation use. [00:13:58] Do you have a comment, Councilman? [00:13:59] Yeah, let me just see if I understood what you were saying. [00:14:03] If we can go back to that slide, this is Pete Altman on the City Council. [00:14:09] You made a comment that indoor use, first couple of tiers, and this is all discretionary, [00:14:18] so this is really probably the crux of the issue from looking at it, which is [00:14:26] you've got a base charge that's an additional charge to a customer, [00:14:30] you've got a customer charge, and you showed us a scatter chart that shows most everybody [00:14:34] in those smaller lots between 4,000 and 8,000 gallons, which would have kept them in Tier 1 [00:14:41] and Tier 2 paying half the rate for water, but then they would have to tack on the sewer. [00:14:47] So what we get at is a no-win situation for a meter for 70 percent of our customers that are [00:14:55] being charged a higher water rate. [00:15:00] In the indoor part, irrigation is all irrigation, because they're going to have, generally, [00:15:03] we would think, a water, a separate water rate inside their house related to their use. [00:15:10] So we're not asking, it doesn't seem like we're encouraging anybody to hold back on [00:15:17] their irrigation meter if they can use up to 15,000 gallons, and they usually don't [00:15:22] use more than nine. [00:15:24] So I don't understand where the incentive is there. [00:15:28] Yeah, so just maybe one comment there is that the graph there that shows your water, that's [00:15:35] the rates that 94% of your customers, as I mentioned, that don't have a separate irrigation [00:15:40] rate. [00:15:41] That's what they're paying. [00:15:43] And so if you didn't have a separate irrigation meter, and you're using, you know, you get [00:15:49] in that 10,000 gallon range, that's when you hit the tier three rate. [00:15:54] And that's really, the way that the rate structure is set up, that's when the outdoor [00:15:58] use or the irrigation use rate or price incentive is kicked in. [00:16:01] So you're trying to, recognizing that you, you know, you may need to use some water in [00:16:07] tier three to irrigate your yard or your landscape, but it's trying to encourage efficient use [00:16:14] of that demand for that water. [00:16:17] I'm Deputy Mayor Jeff Starkey again. [00:16:20] This has been my whole issue this whole time. [00:16:22] Everyone, let me just go back to one clarification question on the graph. [00:16:25] You don't have to go back. [00:16:26] What percentage of our residents, how many, what percentage of the parcels in the City [00:16:31] of New Port Richey have access to reclaimed water? [00:16:33] I have that information. [00:16:35] Because it looked like that last graph was 3%, and I'm like that's, yeah, it's minute. [00:16:39] It's 3%? [00:16:40] Yes. [00:16:41] That's it. [00:16:42] Now 3% has reclaimed. [00:16:43] Isn't that what you asked? [00:16:44] I'm sorry. [00:16:45] And 3%, an extremely low number. [00:16:46] I thought it was much higher than that. [00:16:52] And so what the 3% represents is just the number of connections. [00:16:58] I can't speak to how, you know, if there's connections that have it available, but they're [00:17:03] not connected. [00:17:04] But that's just the number of accounts or connections. [00:17:06] Right. [00:17:07] So there might be, do we have any kind of way to determine how many connections are [00:17:11] available for someone that wanted to take advantage of reclaimed water? [00:17:14] Sure. [00:17:15] Do we have that number? [00:17:19] We can get you that number. [00:17:21] The reason that I believe that that's important is because we have customers, I have residents [00:17:26] that complain to me because of the cost to, we're asking our residents to take care of [00:17:32] their properties, landscape their properties. [00:17:35] We go through dry seasons. [00:17:37] You have to be able to water. [00:17:38] Some properties are larger than others. [00:17:40] But I would like to know that percentage of residents that have access to reclaimed, because [00:17:45] let's say it's 15%. [00:17:47] We now have 15% rather than 3% of residents that can take advantage of reclaimed water. [00:17:52] Yet if you're not, if it's not piped in your neighborhood, like in North River neighborhood, [00:17:57] it stopped at one road, it got like almost halfway through from what I was told, I believe [00:18:02] last time I brought it up. [00:18:03] So let's say it's just, hypothetically speaking, 15 to 20% of the residents have access to [00:18:09] reclaimed water, 3% may be taking advantage of it. [00:18:12] How is that fair and equitable for someone that wants to landscape and take care of their [00:18:16] property? [00:18:18] How many other residents in the city have access to pretty much free landscape water [00:18:20] through reclaimed water? [00:18:22] It's that inexpensive. [00:18:23] And everyone else has to start off at tier three if they have a separate landscape meter. [00:18:27] To me, that's just not, it's not fair and equitable. [00:18:29] And that tier three adds up really, really quick. [00:18:32] So if you've got a pool, you've got to put water in your pool, it comes out of that tier [00:18:34] three. [00:18:35] If you want to water your bushes, your lawns, it comes out right off the bat, tier three. [00:18:40] Meanwhile, we have residents that have access to reclaimed water. [00:18:44] That's not fair and equitable to me at all whatsoever. [00:18:47] And to start off at tier three with, this is just my opinion once again, for landscape [00:18:52] water, it's just, you know, I talk to residents, I don't want to say it out loud because I'm [00:18:56] almost embarrassed that we're charging residents with not, even not very large yards and may [00:19:01] have floor or tan grass, you know, maybe closer to a river, maybe closer to gulf, dry, salty [00:19:07] air that dries the lawns out quicker, I don't know, that are paying exorbitant rates of [00:19:12] water. [00:19:13] I mean, I hear about rates in Gulf Harbors being high. [00:19:14] I mean, if you water your lawn on a regular basis during the dry season, you're paying [00:19:18] hundreds of dollars on occasion with, depending on your parcel, and I just, I have an issue [00:19:22] with it. [00:19:23] Mr. Deputy Mayor, as an example, and I'm sorry to interrupt too, but on the, on this issue, [00:19:28] if we look at what our customers are spending, there would be a point where we would be advising [00:19:33] our customers to disconnect their irrigation meter because they're only using 2,000 gallons [00:19:40] inside their house, and they're only using 6,000 or 8,000 gallons outside their house, [00:19:45] and so they're paying $6 per 1,000 gallons when they could save the base charge and the [00:19:52] customer charge as well as the meter charge. [00:19:56] So how do we make sure our residents are getting the best deal, I think, is kind of spinning [00:20:00] off what the Deputy Mayor said. [00:20:01] Well, I think that would be the purpose of it, to disconnect so that you can meet that [00:20:10] water conservation requirement that you have in your water use permit through the state. [00:20:15] Because the whole idea of it is to have some kind of conservation plan, and the standard [00:20:22] is tier system, block system type of thing, so that by the time we go and reapply for [00:20:28] our permit, the state's already told us that they, in all likelihood, will give us the [00:20:34] same amount, which is $89 million per day to be able to pump, but you're going to have [00:20:39] to deal with supplying water to an expanded utility, to an inflated customer base because [00:20:47] of all developments and everything that is being required of you to supply water to those [00:20:52] people. [00:20:53] So you're going to have to do more with less. [00:20:57] So they're looking at it from a standpoint of you might look at it like it's a tier three, [00:21:04] but they're saying because you're taking that water and you're just putting it back into [00:21:08] the ground, there's got to be some kind of conservation element to it. [00:21:11] I'm not saying that the price couldn't be adjusted, but as far as looking at it, a utility [00:21:17] would look at it and say, okay, you're starting in tier one in your irrigation tiers, and [00:21:24] you only have three tiers. [00:21:26] And I know that's playing with words, okay? [00:21:29] But I'm just saying, we're trying to meet that conservation effort, and with reclaim, [00:21:40] it's great, but it's expensive. [00:21:42] And when we're dealing with water and we're dealing with sewer and the amount of money [00:21:46] that we have to invest in those two categories, reclaim becomes one of those items that you [00:21:53] say, okay, we still want to do it, but what's available for us to do it? [00:21:58] Is there grants available? [00:22:01] Is there legislative money that you can get that maybe that funding is more than what [00:22:06] you can get from grants? [00:22:08] If you can't do that, is it something that we do a sufficiency analysis and find out, [00:22:13] okay, how much money can we dedicate each year to be able to expand the reclaim system [00:22:19] to get to where you want to go? [00:22:21] May I stop you? [00:22:24] So we're talking about our water rates for our potable water here, and you're talking [00:22:30] about our strategy for a tiered rate for conservations for a permit that relates to how much is pumped [00:22:37] out through Tampa Bay Water, I'm assuming, because all of our water is coming as part [00:22:42] of our partnership with Tampa Bay Water, I'm thinking. [00:22:44] So my question is, when we look at our customer base, what bureaucrat is going to tell us [00:22:53] that we aren't still doing a graduated rate if we didn't adopt the same water rates that [00:23:01] we do for potable water, for our regular water, because we're recognizing that that water [00:23:08] rate carries a sewer charge, and so we would give the opportunity to somebody to irrigate [00:23:16] within that same range. [00:23:18] So when you look at the average customer, they don't add, you know, it doesn't add up. [00:23:25] And then when we get into the discussion of reclaim water, I'm all in agreement that, [00:23:31] you know, Deputy Mayor, there's a lot of people could hook up to it, but they're not going [00:23:36] to because they don't have sprinkler system, they don't have the need for it, and they [00:23:40] don't want to spend the money for it, and maybe they're, it's just not, it's not practical. [00:23:47] When new communities are doing it, and we had that great water pipe that went to Pasco, [00:23:52] so that's a whole other discussion. [00:23:53] But I would agree with the Deputy Mayor that we should be adjusting our tiers or our customer [00:23:59] charges if we want to encourage people to make their best deal. [00:24:06] Just one other comment, you've got 46% rentals, those landlords aren't going to worry about [00:24:11] reclaim water, they're not even thinking about water one way or the other. [00:24:15] Right, right. [00:24:16] So I guess my question, another question then is, if I may, how is it determined where we [00:24:23] put reclaim water in? [00:24:24] Woodridge Estates is a deed-restricted neighborhood, they have reclaim water, it's in the city [00:24:29] limits. [00:24:31] The Homeowner's Association at the time had to take a poll and get at least 70% in support [00:24:35] of it. [00:24:36] I mean, are we putting, have we hooked up reclaim water access to neighborhoods that [00:24:41] maybe would not want to irrigate their landscaping and their yards more than maybe, say, another [00:24:48] neighborhood that may be more owner occupancy or a larger lot? [00:24:53] What determined where we put the reclaim water and when there was funding to do it? [00:24:56] We follow a reclaim master plan just like we do with all the different elements of our [00:25:04] utility and that actually calls out and does the modeling of the system just like the other [00:25:10] two elements that we have. [00:25:12] And so that's what we try to follow when it comes to what's the next project, where's [00:25:18] the next transmission line going to come off? [00:25:20] We have a lot of reclaim transmission lines that people will sit there and say, well, [00:25:24] why can't I tie into it? [00:25:26] It's right in my front yard because it's a transmission line and that typically, a transmission [00:25:33] line isn't tapped into. [00:25:36] You branch off with distribution and then distribution goes into where you take and [00:25:40] make your taps and all that modeling requires that you follow that type of system to be [00:25:47] able to get that water where it needs to be. [00:25:50] So to answer your question, what do we follow? [00:25:52] We follow the master plan that's been modeled. [00:25:57] Actually the North River neighborhood was the, up until a few years back, was the next [00:26:04] neighborhood that the master plan had called out to do. [00:26:08] Back in 07, 08, we had sent out a survey. [00:26:14] We actually sent three surveys out. [00:26:16] We did it in February, April, and let me see here. [00:26:25] We sent surveys out in February, April, and September. [00:26:30] Now this is back in 2008. [00:26:33] This was just for grant. [00:26:34] This doesn't mean that we couldn't devote the money and pay for it ourselves, but your [00:26:41] response was 16% for the whole North River neighborhood. [00:26:47] Then we went ahead and we sent out another one and reduced the scope to try to get those [00:26:52] large parcels that were on the river from Palmetto up to Main Street Bridge right in [00:26:59] there. [00:27:00] We figured that if we could get those, then we could at least start branching and take [00:27:05] it little steps at a time. [00:27:08] Of course that response was, while it was higher, it was only 27%. [00:27:13] Back in 011, we attempted it again, did calculations with SWFMUD on the offsets as far as your [00:27:25] numbers on how much money they'll spend, what are they going to get, what's the consumption [00:27:31] going to be, and we failed to meet that. [00:27:35] That doesn't mean, that was one of our recommendations that we were going to tell you at the end, [00:27:42] was that we can take and we can look at these tiers and when we do our revenue sufficiency [00:27:48] analysis in October, that would be the time that we would take and we would look at all [00:27:55] of our dollar amounts, our expenses, what it's going to cost. [00:28:00] We could play with the numbers too. [00:28:04] In your conservation plan, you have to have some type of program called out. [00:28:10] Ours happens to be a tier. [00:28:13] We can still maintain a tier and have a consultant come back and tell us, okay, you can reduce [00:28:20] this dollar amount or you can line them up, like later on when Jeff starts talking, you'll [00:28:25] be able to see how different communities do it. [00:28:28] Some of them have it, some of them don't, but they have their own permits that they [00:28:33] submit and they capture that water however their system is designed to be able to supply [00:28:40] the needs of the residents. [00:28:43] What we're saying is, here's your existing conditions. [00:28:47] We recognize that while they might not be perfect, this is the basis of it and then [00:28:54] we can move forward to try to get some of these things to where we can satisfy all the [00:28:59] items that you have, but I think for us to do that, we're going to have to take that [00:29:04] next step because anything you do with these numbers here, while you're irrigation, there's [00:29:11] a limited amount of percentage of people that have irrigation meters is still going to affect [00:29:18] the other rate payers and it would be the same thing as what you had said, Deputy Mayor, [00:29:23] as far as somebody that has the benefit of reclaimed water and the money that's been [00:29:27] invested in it, why should they have it versus us? [00:29:32] It's the same logic, but we do try to follow the master plan that has identified the most [00:29:41] efficient way to try to keep moving the reclaimed water out to where we want, but we have found [00:29:47] out just like you said, we've taken and we've changed our ordinances to try to make people [00:29:54] not have to pay for backflow preventers and those types of things that would cost you [00:29:59] initial money. [00:30:00] to try to incorporate it into your bill monthly so that you could pay for it over an amount [00:30:06] of time. We've discussed with grants as people wanted to install the irrigation system, and [00:30:13] the problems that we've had is no one has taken advantage of that. Now, when we did [00:30:18] do this study, the one thing that we did notice that I felt like our utility felt short on [00:30:24] was our outreach program. We did identify some items that Jeff would even talk about [00:30:31] later in the PowerPoint that I think that us as public works could do a better job. [00:30:39] Outreach is really important. There's grants for shallow wells from SWFMUD that are available [00:30:44] that we haven't posted up on our website. We haven't sent out brochures to let people [00:30:51] know. We haven't put it in the bridge. That's an item that can help out. There's another [00:30:58] item that is free for residences is your local extension office that will actually offer [00:31:04] the service of having somebody come out if you have different issues with your irrigation [00:31:09] system that can look at that, that can show you different types of plants and those types [00:31:14] of things to where you can make the most out of your landscaping with the least amount [00:31:19] of water. Eventually, we all know we're going to run out of water and we're going to have [00:31:25] to be finding different avenues to be able to make up that difference, whether it's utilizing [00:31:31] gray water, whatever it is. There's got to be different things that we have to do. [00:31:39] One of the options that we were suggesting was for us to incorporate all of these findings [00:31:45] that we were presenting to you to be able to incorporate them into the revenue sufficiency [00:31:50] analysis and then come back with you and say, okay, hey, these are the options. We can charge [00:31:56] this rate or we can have one tier. We're going to have to make it up here in this way or [00:32:02] however we do it. That's the only thing that I can tell you now that I know is for certain [00:32:07] is whatever adjustments we make with a reduction anywhere will have to be made up somewhere [00:32:15] else. [00:32:17] I'm sorry. I'd like to get back to this chart, though, because this is the crux for me, too, [00:32:21] sir. I don't have a whole lot to talk about other than this potable water and the chart [00:32:27] and what you showed us with the scatter chart and how much people use. So if you're going [00:32:33] to encourage me, if I have an irrigation well, to be efficient with my water, and I don't [00:32:40] know this is a calculation, we're going to have to talk about whether you could do it, [00:32:44] why couldn't a person be encouraged to save water in their house because it's the same [00:32:50] rate up to 5,000 gallons. Why can't a person save money in their house to make room for [00:32:58] them to water their lawn a little bit? Why can't we use the water rate for potable water [00:33:04] with sewer attached first, see where that takes us, and then take the irrigation and [00:33:10] continue to play it out in the same manner that somebody that's watering their lawn would [00:33:14] one meter would have? So there is a disadvantage to having an irrigation meter because the [00:33:20] person who's irrigating is losing the incentive to save water to keep a lower irrigation cost. [00:33:27] So my thing would be run through the water bill with the potable, with the sewer, wherever [00:33:32] that ends up. If that's already gotten into tier two, then their next 5,000 gallons is [00:33:38] at 453, not at 602. So couldn't one user follow that pattern of trying to save money [00:33:49] holding back all their water use, irrigation and internal? [00:33:52] Is that a question from Mr. Dykstra? Yes. [00:33:56] So two things on that. Some communities definitely do that, and we'll get to that in the next [00:34:04] slide, actually, and show you some of that. But the other thing, too, is as we'll get [00:34:09] back, as we'll get to in a couple slides, too, is actually for a customer that has 7,000 [00:34:15] gallons of irrigation with a separate meter, there actually is some savings as opposed [00:34:21] to someone who would use that 7,000 through the top structure there if they're also paying [00:34:28] for sewer. So it really all depends on how much irrigation demand you have from month [00:34:34] to month. But why don't we move on, and I can show you some of those slides here coming [00:34:41] up. So directly relative to that, we did a comparison [00:34:46] with the entities you see on the screen in these communities. And this is just to give [00:34:51] us an idea, a snapshot of locally what are other communities doing with their potable [00:34:56] irrigation rate structure. And overwhelmingly, seven out of the eight communities do offer [00:35:04] separate potable irrigation meters. The only exception there is Pinellas County. And so [00:35:09] it's a very common practice. The only variation really is between community, how many customers [00:35:16] take advantage of the separate meter. That will vary pretty substantially, I think, between [00:35:22] some of the entities. But the overall takeaway from this slide really is that your existing [00:35:28] rate structure is generally in line with the local practice. And to directly address your [00:35:36] question there, Councilman Altman, is the line notice is separate rates for irrigation [00:35:42] service. And you'll see New Port Richey there, we have a yes. And that just reflects the [00:35:48] previous graph that we were looking at. The rates are tied, meaning your irrigation is [00:35:52] linked to the third tier. But there are slightly different rates. They're not exactly linked [00:35:57] up to the water. And that's what those yeses mean for those different communities. But [00:36:01] there are some like Tampa and Hillsborough that have the same rate structure across the [00:36:08] line for a separate irrigation meter like you were mentioning. [00:36:14] And all communities use a readiness to serve charge where they have separate potable irrigation [00:36:18] rates. And then as you can see on the bottom, the inclining block rate structure is also [00:36:24] widely used. But the takeaway from this is that these different components of your irrigation [00:36:30] rate structure are definitely in line with what others are doing locally, but also throughout [00:36:35] Florida and nationally. Relative to the specific usage rates, this graphic depicts really a [00:36:44] comparison of not only the tiers for irrigation service, but also the pricing. And as you [00:36:51] can see New Port Richey there in the middle, from a pricing standpoint, you're really in [00:36:56] the middle from as far as pricing within each tier. You're not the highest or lowest in [00:37:00] tier 1, not the highest or lowest in tier 2, and a similar status there on the higher [00:37:07] usage tier 3. But that just gives you an idea of some of the tier thresholds that other [00:37:13] communities are using for irrigation service. And, you know, if you overlay this with your [00:37:19] water rate structure, you look more like Tarpon Springs. Just from a tiered structure, you'd [00:37:23] see your tier, your current tier 1 there would be broken into three, just like your water [00:37:31] rates are. So that, again, the takeaway from this is that, again, your pricing by tier and [00:37:38] the tier sizing is also in line with what others are doing locally. [00:37:42] Mr. Dykstra, if I may, it's Jeff Starkey again. My takeaway from this is when I look at [00:37:47] those tiers, it's a small chart, so I just had to go up and make sure I was reading it [00:37:51] right. Our first tier for irrigation is double what the county charges. Am I reading that [00:37:57] correctly? [00:38:00] Yep. [00:38:02] That speaks volumes to me. [00:38:03] Roughly double, yeah. [00:38:04] Volumes to me. Double the price. [00:38:07] But, you know, one, it is for the first 10,000 gallons, but then you see by 10 to 15, [00:38:14] their rate's higher than your... [00:38:17] Could you read them out because it's hard to read. What's a tier 2 rate? [00:38:21] Yeah, so the... [00:38:21] The county compared to the city. [00:38:24] They're at 621. [00:38:26] And we're at what? [00:38:27] They're at 602. [00:38:28] Okay, so we're, it's about the same. It's very, very close. And then tier 3 is what? [00:38:33] Yep. [00:38:34] Or the next tier, I'm sorry. [00:38:36] They're at 837 and you're at... [00:38:37] Yep, they're at 837 for all remaining use above 15. [00:38:44] My mathematical question, if I can jump in, has been not to do what I'm looking at, but [00:38:50] to take the irrigation as a continuation of the tier structure, not as a separate tier [00:38:56] structure. So I'm saying if I'm really good at not using water in my house because I want [00:39:00] to water my plants, these two are separate meters. [00:39:04] It would take some serious work by IT or, you know, our great Tyler of billing. [00:39:10] But I have a question, which is whether or not we could tie our irrigation volumetric [00:39:16] rates to continuing for that person's monthly total usage to implement our one single tier. [00:39:25] That only is allowing them to drop the sewer off, but it's really enticing them to keep [00:39:30] their water use down so they can make room for the irrigation, save the most money [00:39:34] possible. And I know the answer is wherever we let someone save money, it's going to have [00:39:39] to be made up somewhere else, which is what's being said. [00:39:42] But I think when we talk about the whole fairness quotient and who can have cheap water [00:39:47] and what it is around and a three percent of our total, you know, we're focusing in on a [00:39:55] three percent aspect of our water system. [00:39:58] So I just don't see that having a tremendous impact on on our rates. [00:40:04] I mean, if you told me how much we were going to lose or have to make up a year, I'm [00:40:08] guessing it's not going to be that much. [00:40:10] I think we're just getting a skinning off. [00:40:12] I don't have any totals, but Jeff does say as part of his work that if we were to reduce [00:40:23] the one point nine percent of customers that have the independent meters down, then all [00:40:31] of the other customers would have to be bumped up 12 cents for every four thousand gallons [00:40:37] of use. And Mr. [00:40:39] Rivera, if I may, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. [00:40:42] One second. I didn't mean to cut you off. [00:40:45] So who or what determines who has a separate meter for landscape use? [00:40:51] The property owner just does it on their own. [00:40:54] Correct. If if the availability of reclaimed water is not there and if they choose not [00:41:01] to to install a well, then their next option would be to contact the city and get an [00:41:07] irrigation meter. Even with the shallow wells, I thought we were trying to move away [00:41:11] from wells due to leakage and things like that. [00:41:15] Correct or no? Not the groundwater ones, the residential ones. [00:41:20] Now, in North River, that might not be possible because you might have more saltwater [00:41:25] than what the grass could tolerate. [00:41:27] And obviously you'd have to go deeper. [00:41:30] But that's an option. [00:41:33] No, I just I think I got my point. [00:41:36] Sitting here listening, just taking the average person at home, I think we've got a serious [00:41:40] marketing problem. I don't think the public knows what they're up to. [00:41:43] And, you know, I will add to that that. [00:41:48] Oh, excuse me. [00:41:49] Go ahead. [00:41:50] I was going to say the comment was made about the question or comment was made relative to, [00:42:00] you know, syncing up the irrigation rates and the water rates or the tiers. [00:42:05] And one of the reasons you also have a wastewater cap and that's sort of along those [00:42:11] lines is once you get to a certain amount of usage on your domestic meter, you're not [00:42:16] charged sewer for anything above that. [00:42:18] So that could be something else that you look at as part of the overall rate structure is [00:42:22] adjusting that sewer cap. [00:42:24] And Mr. [00:42:25] Why do we have a sewer cap? [00:42:26] We were still all the way cap on. [00:42:29] We don't have a cap on buying. [00:42:31] We have a cap on the price. [00:42:32] Is that what you're trying to say? [00:42:34] I'm billing price. [00:42:36] So if you have more sewage going out, we're. [00:42:40] It's getting the price is getting capped at some level. [00:42:44] That's the way I understand it, Robert. [00:42:48] I mean, so much we can put into that sewer in a house, you know, but I agree with [00:42:53] Councilman Davis, to be honest with you, I couldn't tell you if my I have landscaping [00:42:57] irrigation on my property. [00:42:59] I couldn't tell you right now if I have a separate meter or not. [00:43:03] I honestly don't know. [00:43:04] You actually, you know, a few minutes ago you get Robert. [00:43:07] I'm talking for Jeff's purpose. [00:43:09] I'm talking, Robert, you gave us all these different options that are available, you [00:43:13] know, and I don't think the public has a clue. [00:43:16] You know, and Charles got some some young kid up there that's great at marketing. [00:43:21] We have a young man that has taken over the responsibility for marketing and we will [00:43:28] going forward do a better job promoting water efficiency through various media mediums [00:43:37] as as well as options that people have for how to irrigate on a independent meter if [00:43:48] they choose to do so. [00:43:52] But it sounds like we've got a sensitivity issue here and there are variations in [00:43:57] every community because of sensitivities. [00:44:01] And it sounds to me as if some of the direction that we're receiving is we need to [00:44:06] come up with a method to bring down the rate for the irrigation on the independent. [00:44:19] Oh, I think the selling of the selling of the selling of reclaimed water, if you if [00:44:26] you're out there selling, right, market it, then more people will get on the program. [00:44:29] And when you go to send these letters out, then they're ready and they're going to [00:44:33] throw it away. But if they've been paying attention, they've listened to they get it [00:44:37] in the bridge, they get it, you know, lots of different places. [00:44:39] Then finally, you know, we have a meeting in their neighborhood. [00:44:43] I mean, lots of different things we could do. [00:44:45] You know, then when you go to get that that survey and you send a survey, they look at [00:44:49] it and you get results instead of them just throwing it away. [00:44:51] That's phenomenal. Yeah, again, I think the city public utilities is a business. [00:44:56] And so when you look at it from a business standpoint from the city. [00:45:00] It doesn't make sense for us to spend a million dollars, have SwiftMUD deny us. [00:45:04] And even if we had enough people, we still have to match it. [00:45:07] So do we want to spend two, three, four, $500,000? [00:45:12] If we go to the heart of this issue, which is showing that you're trying to encourage conservation, [00:45:18] we start with the premise that we want to have people use less water, [00:45:22] and that is counterproductive to an income-producing scheme, you know, to make money off a profit. [00:45:29] So the bottom line is we have to encourage people to use less water. [00:45:33] My point is the irrigation meters don't really encourage that in the house [00:45:38] because it doesn't get them an opportunity to save money to save it for the plants. [00:45:43] So the irrigation meter is just, well, we're losing the sewer surcharge, [00:45:47] so our overall revenue is going to drop if more people move onto the potable water meter [00:45:52] because we're not going to get as much sewer charge in. [00:45:55] And our sewage never really made much profit. [00:45:58] Our sewage was always more like a break-even, and the water was where we made our profit. [00:46:02] But nevertheless, it's an additional charge. [00:46:05] If you wanted to encourage conservation, and I had a house, whether I had a separate meter or not, [00:46:12] I would want to be told, if you only use this much water, this is how much it's going to cost. [00:46:17] So I think there's a discrepancy in the process, and it's probably because it's not easy. [00:46:24] If you have a separate meter, that meter is going to read, and it needs to start from here and go to there. [00:46:28] Now, if you tell that meter, look at this other meter, and then take over where that meter stopped and follow that, [00:46:35] I'm sure that's a pretty difficult situation. [00:46:39] So I may be asking for something that can't be done. [00:46:41] I'm just suggesting that if you're trying to save water, that you would save it as a household. [00:46:48] Now you have two meters, you've got two different schemes in mind, [00:46:51] which is I can spend, I can use 15,000 gallons before my water rate goes up on the irrigation, [00:46:57] versus, all right, I'm trying to save holistically the water that my, the footprint of water use of my house. [00:47:05] So I know it's, I'm sorry to put it that way, but I think that it might be too complicated to implement, [00:47:13] which is why nobody's doing it. [00:47:15] But I'm throwing it out there to say, maybe the house next door that doesn't have an irrigation meter, [00:47:22] but it's watering their plants, and if they found out that they could have a separate meter and lower their sewer bill, [00:47:30] which is really what entices people to get an irrigation meter, generally, right, to save the sewer bill, pardon? [00:47:38] Right. [00:47:39] And most of our customers aren't using more than 8,000 or 9,000 gallons. [00:47:43] Our whole scheme of a tier out at 15,000 gallons is not even applying to a small percent of the 3% of the people that are using it. [00:47:51] So we focus on our customers and figure out what's the best way. [00:47:55] You just hit the nail on the head for me, and it's just, I can't get over this graph, you know. [00:47:59] The county charges $3 for the first tier of irrigation up to 10,000, and we're double that, up to 15,000. [00:48:09] I could see maybe we're 25% higher, but we're double. [00:48:13] That's a huge jump. [00:48:15] It may just affect a small, small portion of city parcels. [00:48:20] I'm sure that's probably the case, but I just feel like those particular parcel owners are trying to beautify their community, [00:48:28] and they're getting hit pretty hard with the cost to do so. [00:48:31] That's where I'm at on this whole thing. [00:48:34] The only thing I'll say, and I can verify it for you, I'm not really sure about the county system and the methodology that's used to arrive at that rate. [00:48:46] I do know that Stantec is the same consultant that the county uses that Jeff is working for. [00:48:54] I will give you an example. [00:48:55] If you take the city of Tampa, obviously their production of water is going to be a whole lot cheaper than ours, [00:49:02] because they've got the Hillsborough River. [00:49:05] They're taking surface water. [00:49:07] It's right there. [00:49:09] They can produce it a lot cheaper than what we can, and so while I understand what you're saying, [00:49:17] but maybe it should be a little bit smaller gap, not as high, [00:49:23] but if you do the same methodology as far as the operation of our utility versus the county, [00:49:30] you are going to come up with a different number for sure, but I'm not disputing you. [00:49:36] We'd have to look at it and see what the difference is. [00:49:40] I know you're the expert. [00:49:42] I'm just going off how I read this graph. [00:49:45] Mr. Dykstra, did you want to go on with any more slides? [00:49:49] Yeah, I've got a couple more, and it may shed some light on the conversation, too. [00:49:53] So hopefully you can see this, but I mean, said, okay, if we know what our typical customer is, [00:49:58] it's a residential customer, and they use 7,000 gallons per month of irrigation demand, [00:50:05] this is just for that portion of the bill, so this would be just for the irrigation, separate irrigation meter. [00:50:11] You know, relative to the other communities here, you're right there in the middle, right around the average, [00:50:15] so for a customer with this size meter, 7,000 gallons, that bill is about $53 a month, [00:50:22] just for the irrigation demand or the irrigation meter associated with their account, [00:50:27] and so you can see right there in the middle relative to some of the other communities, [00:50:33] and then the next slide, we said, okay, if we know how much the monthly irrigation bill is at 7,000 gallons per month, [00:50:43] you know, a typical customer is going to have a separate, that separate domestic meter as well with water and sewer on it, [00:50:49] and for the city, that averages about 4,000 gallons a month, so that bill with water and sewer is reflected by the black bars there, [00:50:57] at 4,000 gallons for water and sewer, and then we added on the 7,000 gallons of irrigation, [00:51:03] and you can see just from an overall affordability standpoint or comparison standpoint, [00:51:08] again, the city is right there, right in the middle, compared to the other entities on there. [00:51:13] So, you know, from a cost comparison standpoint, your rates aren't, you know, significantly higher than, [00:51:21] they are higher than the counties, as has been pointed out, but relative to some of the other communities, it's, you know, you're not absorbing it. [00:51:34] And so another important thing, and this has been touched on a little bit, but, you know, [00:51:38] any modifications you make to your irrigation rate structure has impacts on your rates and your overall financial sustainability, [00:51:46] and so it's important to know that the revenues from these meters account for only about 2% of your overall rate revenues, [00:51:53] and so that's important to consider, you know, if you were to adjust rates here, [00:51:58] you'd have to make it up from, say, your water and sewer rates in order to recover your overall system costs, [00:52:05] and if you do that, you also have to keep in mind the relationship between your water rates and your potable irrigation rates. [00:52:11] It's the same water. It's just a matter of which meter it's going through, [00:52:15] and so you have to be cognizant of any potential equity concerns that may arise from, you know, [00:52:21] modifications specifically to the irrigation rates themselves or rate structure, [00:52:27] but part of analyzing and revising your irrigation rates, that's something that you definitely can do, [00:52:33] and we can do as part of a, you know, a comprehensive rate study, which we'll talk about on the next slide, [00:52:39] but you have to do it within the context of, okay, I know one of my objectives may be to, you know, [00:52:47] lessen the blow on that first year for irrigation. How is that going to impact all my other rates? [00:52:52] And Robert has touched on a couple of these, but there are some alternatives to potable water, [00:52:57] and you have the potential for reclaimed water expansion. [00:53:00] The obvious barrier is the upfront capital cost for that, but that's something to think about. [00:53:05] Customers also concerned about price have the option to, you know, install private wells, [00:53:10] and the other thing, too, is to think about each customer may want to do an analysis, [00:53:16] and as a city, one option could be to help them do that to understand, [00:53:20] does a separate potable water irrigation meter make sense for my particular situation? [00:53:25] So that's some of the things to think about, and then in conclusion and findings, [00:53:32] really, I want to highlight a couple of good news things out of this is that I know there's been some questions [00:53:38] about the existing rate structure, and is it the most appropriate, but from a, you know, [00:53:43] industry standard or in local practice, your rate structure and your rates are pretty comparable, [00:53:48] and so that's a, you know, that's a good thing as opposed to being way out of alignment with what others are doing. [00:53:54] Your existing tier grades are aligned with the city's strong conservation goals and compliance with the water use permit, [00:54:01] and as I mentioned on the previous slide, just from a management practice standpoint, [00:54:06] any modifications to your irrigation rates or rate structure has to be done within the context of analyzing your water [00:54:13] and sewer rates and your sustainability of your utility as a whole, [00:54:18] and make sure that those adjustments are in line with your objectives that you've outlined from a policy standpoint, [00:54:25] and as Robert has also mentioned, you know, continuously looking at alternatives for expanding reclaimed water as available, [00:54:32] as an example, and associated costs with that. [00:54:36] You know, for certain communities, that may be, the cost barrier may be too great. [00:54:40] For others, it may be something that customer sentiment changes over time, [00:54:44] and so that's something to always be aware of and analyzing, [00:54:48] and one of the things, too, that we're recommending as a result of this analysis is really some continued [00:54:55] and possibly expansion of some stakeholder outreach. [00:54:59] Number one, does the customers know that, you know, [00:55:03] switching to a potable irrigation meter may save them money or may not, [00:55:07] but they need to have the ability to analyze that for themselves. [00:55:11] Secondly, if you have an irrigation meter, do you have the appropriate meter size for your parcel, your demand? [00:55:18] If you have a one-inch meter, for example, you could save $15 on the fixed charge by switching down to a five-eighths-inch meter, [00:55:24] as an example, and then just really analyzing from a customer standpoint, [00:55:30] helping them understand, am I using the right amount of water for my parcel? [00:55:35] Are the irrigation demands, do I have any, do I have leaks? [00:55:37] Do I have other things going on that are causing my irrigation to spike on a monthly basis relative to my overall parcel size? [00:55:47] And then just continued communication and education for customers relative to, you know, [00:55:52] your twice-a-week watering restrictions and education relative to your overall conservation objectives, [00:55:59] and I think the really good news is Citi has an outline policy relative to conservation, [00:56:05] a conservation plan, which Robert can get into more detail on, but it's really a positive, [00:56:11] you know, a step in the right direction and maybe one that needs to be communicated to the community. [00:56:18] So with that, I mean, I know one of the questions that I didn't cover in this presentation on a previous slide there was just relative to a typical customer. [00:56:28] If we look at this graph, the blue bar represents the use at 7,000 gallons of irrigation. [00:56:35] If we overlay this with instead of, if we switch that 7,000 gallons of irrigation from the secondary irrigation meter and put that all onto the domestic meter, [00:56:46] instead of paying 5,304, that bill would have been 6,256. [00:56:51] So actually, in this particular example, this customer has a savings of roughly, you know, [00:56:57] $9 or so by having that separate irrigation meter. [00:57:00] And so it's really going to be dependent upon how much water a customer is using on a monthly basis and also between both of their meters. [00:57:12] That needs to be weighed, so just wanted to point that out. [00:57:14] I know that was a topic or a question that was asked previously, so. [00:57:18] Mr. Dykstra, if I may. [00:57:21] Sure. [00:57:22] Go ahead. [00:57:22] I just had a question for you, and or Ms. Rivera. [00:57:24] This is Jeff Starkey again. [00:57:26] I'm trying to simplify this as best I can. [00:57:30] There's a lot of variables involved. [00:57:31] I know we're looking at these different tier rates based on usage, so you mentioned parcel size. [00:57:38] So if we have a parcel with inner city limits with a very responsible homeowner that irrigates his or her lawn and landscaping and takes pride in their property [00:57:51] and helps beautify their neighborhood, compared to somebody with half an acre of land, [00:57:58] these two residents could be watering just the same amount of time within the constraints of what they're allowed to do landscaping-wise. [00:58:09] But the customer with the half an acre, even though they're not watering more, they are using much more water based on the size of their parcel. [00:58:18] Is there any way we could look into amending the tier structure based on the size of the parcel? [00:58:27] Because it's not like resident B with half an acre is watering five times as much as resident A with a quarter acre. [00:58:34] They're watering the same amount. [00:58:35] They're just trying to beautify that much more property in the city limits. [00:58:40] Jeff, are you familiar with something like that? [00:58:42] Have you worked with any other agencies? [00:58:46] Yeah, no, that's an interesting question. [00:58:48] I haven't specifically, you know, heard of an example of that. [00:58:51] One of the issues I can see with it is just from an equity standpoint, because a lot of your water costs are based on the amount of water. [00:58:59] For example, you're purchasing water in quantity. [00:59:03] And so, you know, you said that even though they may not be watering the same amount, in one sense that's true. [00:59:10] But on the other sense, they're using that much more water. [00:59:12] And that's causing, you know, the city to purchase that much more water. [00:59:16] And so that cost needs to be passed on. [00:59:18] So that's one of the challenges I see with that type of approach from an equity standpoint, [00:59:23] because it's really your water use isn't really dependent on parcel size directly. [00:59:30] You could have a customer with a smaller parcel size using a lot more water or the same as someone with a parcel size that's double what theirs is. [00:59:39] So I think that would be I could see some equity concerns with that. [00:59:45] I can't think of an example of a community that's doing that at this moment. [00:59:50] Any other questions for Mr. Dykstra? [00:59:53] I just want to go back one more time to say that when you saw the scattered chart and you saw the percentage of people and how much water. [01:00:00] they used, those are our customers, and so we need to analyze what we're doing with an [01:00:06] eye to our customers, what they're using, how much they're using. [01:00:11] And I'm going to say I'm sort of with the Deputy Mayor in the sense that if that chart [01:00:19] showed that he saved a little money, but if that customer had a 2,000-gallon use of water [01:00:25] and sewer and used the same amount of water irrigation, he's losing money by that irrigation [01:00:33] meter. [01:00:34] So only in fairness, we might want to say from a beautification standpoint, irrigation [01:00:40] of our yards is a critical use that should be allowed. [01:00:44] We should have at least some minimal point, even if it's not 5,000 gallons, if it's 2,000 [01:00:50] gallons, if it's whatever, to say we encourage you to keep this community looking good because [01:00:55] I've heard that theme from the Deputy Mayor that it enhances our city, it's a requirement [01:01:02] to keep yourself alive with your landscaping. [01:01:07] We push the other, xeriscaping, Councilman Davis talked about the, you know, and what [01:01:14] you said about going to find out what plants you can use, xeriscaping, trying to save money, [01:01:20] having low water usage, but I think if someone has an irrigation meter, they ought to be [01:01:25] able to have a certain quantity of water that is not more than Pasco County, and what throws [01:01:31] me the most is knowing that our agreement with Pasco County and our larger area, our [01:01:36] larger service area says we shouldn't be charging more than they are, or else that somehow brings [01:01:44] into question the Maytum Chambers Boundary Service Agreement. [01:01:48] This is irrigation, though. [01:01:51] So be it, but, you know, do we charge, do we have irrigation meters out in the county? [01:01:57] Yes, I do believe so. [01:02:00] Okay, and they're charging, we charge them an extra 50% off of our rates, so, you know, [01:02:06] a county resident that would look and say, I have an irrigation meter here, and I'm only [01:02:12] paying this much, and the county is paying more than the $6. [01:02:16] I would have to find that out. [01:02:17] Crystal, do you know that? [01:02:18] Do we add the outside for irrigation, or is it just a flat, that's what the charge is? [01:02:25] Yeah, you have a 25% surcharge on irrigation, so there is a sensitivity of the county to [01:02:32] our rates that we agreed to when we had a larger expanded area that I think ought to [01:02:36] at least be internally looked at, and I think we could solve it by going to that lower rate [01:02:42] for the first several thousand gallons, because they were actually higher. [01:02:45] Maybe our next tier matches theirs and is higher, you know, but that's a conservation [01:02:52] technique. [01:02:53] Here, irrigation is going to be one charge, one rate, for everybody that uses that meter, [01:02:59] 90% of them were under that 9, 8,000 to 4,000 range in the scatter chart, so that's all [01:03:06] I'm asking is to look at the scatter chart and maybe reconsider that, and if it costs [01:03:11] overall a few dollars more in sewer because we're going to lose sewer rate because we're [01:03:17] having people pull off over onto the irrigation meters, then so be it, that maybe our sewer [01:03:22] rate has to go up a little bit to compensate for it. [01:03:26] One option in this analysis is to look at, you know, you can change some of the pricing [01:03:31] incentives between tiers, so if you were interested in, you know, lowering that tier one irrigation [01:03:37] rate, for example, you could sink it to water, or you could lower it, and, you know, that [01:03:44] would make the tiers, the second or third tier for irrigation a little bit higher as [01:03:47] an example, but you just have to make sure that, you know, there's thoughtful process [01:03:51] done between how you're adjusting your irrigation rates and your water rates to make sure that, [01:03:56] you know, you're addressing any differences in equity, but also recovering your total [01:04:00] system's cost requirements, so. [01:04:03] Councilman Davis or Councilman Murphy, any questions or concerns? [01:04:08] Mr. Dijkstra? [01:04:10] Is there any direction we'd like to give staff other than Councilman Altman's recommendations? [01:04:15] I'm just, my bottom line is I see some water bills for some folks that have beautiful lawns [01:04:21] that beautify neighborhoods that, in my opinion, are just way, way, way too high, and they're [01:04:26] watering twice a week within the confines of what they're allowed to do, and once again, [01:04:30] I'm not going to be spitting out numbers here because I don't want to scare any potential [01:04:35] new poetry residents away or, you know, deter them from putting an irrigation system in [01:04:41] if that's what they want to do, but I'm just telling you, I've seen some rates on even [01:04:45] yards that aren't all that big that just make me just step back and say, is this for real? [01:04:50] You know, and that's just kind of where I'm at. [01:04:52] I know maybe a low percentage of residents, but you referenced, and I was very surprised [01:04:58] to hear the low numbers as far as response to the reclaimed water surveys that we did, [01:05:05] but those were 12 and 13 years ago. [01:05:07] I would say that a lot has changed in our city limits in the last 12 or 13 years. [01:05:12] I think the average homeowner, property owner, whether they reside in the home or rent the [01:05:18] home out, honestly take, on average, much more pride in their property than maybe residents [01:05:25] did on average 12 to 15 years ago. [01:05:27] I think we're seeing that throughout our city. [01:05:29] We're seeing homes get bought up, get renovated, get landscaping put in. [01:05:33] It's beautifying neighborhoods. [01:05:34] It's having a positive impact, and I just want to make it as fair and equitable for [01:05:39] the people that are trying to do the right thing as possible, and when I see those first [01:05:44] tier rates up to, what was it, 10,000, 15,000 gallons double what the county's charging [01:05:49] and our tier goes much longer on that bar graph than theirs does, it just makes me wonder [01:05:56] that is there anything we can do to get them just a bit lower and just look at different [01:06:01] scenarios. [01:06:02] I'm not trying to prevent us from making money off water by any means, but I am trying to [01:06:06] beautify the city and encourage our residents to do so as well, so that's kind of the premise [01:06:10] of my concern here. [01:06:12] Yeah, I think we got direction. [01:06:13] I think that we're going to review the chart that you're talking about, see if we can do [01:06:18] anything. [01:06:19] We're going to review those rates, see what we can do, and then Councilman Davis, like [01:06:24] I had said, and I agree wholeheartedly with you, I think that we could do a better job [01:06:28] of outreach. [01:06:29] Are we selling all our reclaimed water? [01:06:32] No, sir. [01:06:33] And what's bad about that is it's a double-edged sword because, you know, when you have a drought, [01:06:42] you don't have enough reclaimed water, but then when you get into the rainy season, nobody's [01:06:46] using it, and that's when, from a utility perspective, that's when we need to get rid [01:06:51] of it. [01:06:52] But, no, to answer your question, but we can do a better job outreaching. [01:06:57] We have started the process with getting all our survey material to go out to the North [01:07:04] River neighborhood and see where we can go from there. [01:07:08] And please don't think I'm speaking on behalf of just the North River neighborhood. [01:07:11] I'm talking citywide, but a lot of the residents in that neighborhood know me personally because [01:07:15] I live there, so they reach out to me. [01:07:17] Well, I can add to it. [01:07:19] It's in our master plan, and that's why we started it back in 07, because it was the [01:07:24] last area that we would call had low-hanging fruit, the large-sized lots that you could [01:07:30] get rid of some of that reclaimed water, and the amount of money that you invest, your [01:07:34] return on investment was a lot higher. [01:07:37] But the problem that we've run into is back in 07, we were looking at almost a $3 million [01:07:43] project. [01:07:45] Our reclaimed system is a new system. [01:07:47] Everything we do pretty much now calls for transmission mains and expansion, and that [01:07:52] is really expensive. [01:07:54] And so when you look at it, you really would like to be able to have grant money to be [01:07:59] able to get you out there. [01:08:01] But if the grant money is not there, I think one of the things that we can do with Jeff [01:08:06] is when we're looking at this system, maybe we do like we did our stormwater master plan [01:08:12] where when the recession hit, we went ahead and kept the same projects in the next master [01:08:19] plan that we did, the updated plan, but we took those projects and we cut them in half [01:08:24] or in quarters to where we still kept moving forward and accomplishing those goals. [01:08:31] So if it looks like it's something that the council wants, we'll start off with grants, [01:08:38] and then while Jeff and Stantec are doing the study, we'll also tell them, hey, we're [01:08:43] looking at wanting to see how much we can take and we can appropriate for this type [01:08:49] of project on an annual basis. [01:08:53] And so maybe that neighborhood takes us four phases, but it's better than sitting – if [01:08:59] we would have started four phases back in 08, everybody would have reclaimed now. [01:09:06] There's no return on investment when you don't charge for something. [01:09:10] So that's kind of the bottom line. [01:09:13] It's offset. [01:09:14] It's by usage. [01:09:15] I didn't use return on investment, but you're offset of what you're going to get back. [01:09:20] In the green neighborhood and a good lawn and all that, I'm with you. [01:09:23] But economically, it's an expense. [01:09:26] Correct. [01:09:27] It's the right thing to do, so to speak. [01:09:30] Well, Mr. Dykstra, thank you so much. [01:09:32] Mr. Rivera, thank you. [01:09:34] Does anyone have any communications or did you want to wait until after the regular meeting? [01:09:38] Wait for me. [01:09:41] Wait? [01:09:42] Entertain a motion to adjourn the work session then? [01:09:44] Move to adjourn. [01:09:45] Meeting adjourned.

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3. 3Communications
4. 4Adjournment