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1. 1Call to Order - Roll Call▶ 0:00
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   Discussion Regarding Future Waste Hauling Services

   discussed

   Staff presented three potential changes to waste hauling: moving from six providers to a smaller number (possibly via exclusive franchise or zones requiring three years' notice), consolidated billing on water bills with the city collecting franchise and administrative fees, and ending common-pile yard debris pickup in favor of curbside collection. Council gave direction to pursue limiting the number of haulers (likely to three) and to explore consolidated billing, while expressing concerns about service quality and monopolies; yard debris was discussed with concern about commercial abuse of pile pickup.

   • direction:Council gave informal direction to staff to pursue reducing the number of waste haulers (around three) rather than a single exclusive franchise, and to further explore consolidated billing on water bills. (none)

   📍19th (JD Parker / WasteProUSA building)🏢JD Parker🏢Republic🏢Seaside🏢WasteProUSA👤Chopper👤Crystal👤Debbie Manz👤Jeff👤Matt👤Starkey#Consolidated billing on water bills with administrative fee#Franchise fee collection and audit#Outside storage ordinance#Single hauler / exclusive franchise three-year notice requirement#Water ordinance amendment to make property owner responsible#Yard debris curbside vs. common pile pickup

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   [00:00:13] The first and only item on the discussion for tonight's workshop is a discussion [00:00:18] regarding future, I can't even say it, future waste hauling services. [00:00:23] Ms. [00:00:24] Manz, take it away. [00:00:24] Yes, sir. [00:00:25] Mr. [00:00:25] Mayor, glad to. [00:00:26] Wanted to have an opportunity to speak to you about the city's program for solid [00:00:35] waste hauling and disposal. [00:00:38] As all of you are already aware, we have six providers in the city that take away [00:00:46] residential and commercial solid waste. [00:00:50] They all do so with the exception of JD Parker at the county rate. [00:00:57] The one of the primary things that I want to talk to you about is about [00:01:03] potentially going to a single hauler system. [00:01:07] And that would mean that the city would competitively bid the service and we [00:01:14] would have one hauler on the street. [00:01:16] The reason that I wanted to talk about it tonight is because if we go with an [00:01:22] exclusive franchise, we have to provide the haulers with three years notice that [00:01:29] we plan to go to a single hauler. [00:01:32] Now, there are some discretionary powers within that requirement that if we came [00:01:43] to an agreement that was mutually acceptable to all of the providers, that [00:01:49] we wouldn't have to wait the full three years. [00:01:52] In my mind, there is opportunity to establish districts and in doing so, we [00:02:03] would be achieving having fewer of the trucks on the properties or on our roadways. [00:02:13] We would be ensuring that all of our residents receive service, I'm certain [00:02:22] based on the numbers that the haulers are providing to us, that we do not have [00:02:30] 100% coverage in the city for the pickup of residential waste at least. [00:02:38] We think that if it were competitively bid, that we would get a lower rate and [00:02:43] be able to pass that on to our residents. [00:02:47] And the last reason why it's a good idea, or at least we think that it's a good [00:02:54] idea, is because they do pay a franchise fee. [00:03:00] And if we ensure that everybody's a customer, then we ensure that our 10% is [00:03:06] based appropriately on the number of households and multifamily residences [00:03:14] within the city. [00:03:16] If it's agreeable to you to do that, there's a process involved in that, and [00:03:22] we would need to conduct a public hearing. [00:03:25] We would need to competitively solicit the service and either wait out the [00:03:32] remainder of the notice period or negotiate with the purveyors for a system [00:03:39] that would be agreeable to all involved. [00:03:43] The second part about that, that I'll need some input from you on, is the [00:03:56] process, which in conjunction with providing the service, we would like to [00:04:02] establish a system of consolidated billing. [00:04:06] The reason we would like to do that is to improve the likelihood that people will [00:04:13] pay the bill. [00:04:15] We would be putting the trash bills on water bills. [00:04:20] It's not preempted by the state constitution or any Florida law. [00:04:26] And when the collection rate goes up, so does the franchise fee, and it's also a [00:04:34] source of revenue for the city because we could charge an administrative fee for [00:04:40] collecting on behalf of the haulers. [00:04:43] We could not, though, shut off somebody's water because they didn't pay their [00:04:49] trash bill. [00:04:51] And those are the first two parts of what I want to discuss and get input from you [00:05:00] on tonight. [00:05:02] The third is probably, I'm a little bit more timid to ask you about it, and it is, [00:05:13] do we want to consider having people put compost or... [00:05:21] Yard debris. [00:05:22] Thank you. [00:05:23] Yard debris at the curb rather than in common piles. [00:05:27] Right now, under the county rate, we are paying for that service, or our residents [00:05:35] are paying for that service because that is the way the county administers the [00:05:39] program. [00:05:41] So we either need to make a decision about whether or not the pile system is [00:05:49] working, or we need to... [00:05:54] And if that's the case, we need to get a lower rate from the provider since we are [00:06:00] not fully relying on their system. [00:06:05] And we're paying almost $200,000 a year in costs to pick up yard debris in piles [00:06:15] rather than allowing people to place it at the curb. [00:06:19] So those are three elements that I need to find out and determine your level of [00:06:25] interest so the staff knows how to go forward. [00:06:36] So these are the initial thoughts that come to my head. [00:06:40] I'm all about service. [00:06:41] And number one, let me preface by saying, I like the idea of having less huge [00:06:47] trucks on roads, but I'm all about service. [00:06:50] I just switched carriers because the guy, the company I was picking up my garbage [00:06:54] was starting to show up between 6 and 7.30 at night. [00:06:58] You know, I'm like, called them up more than once, they ran over my sprinkler [00:07:01] heads three, four times. [00:07:02] You know, oh, sorry, it wasn't awesome. [00:07:04] Yeah, it was, I saw it, would you approve? [00:07:05] No. [00:07:06] All right, you're done. [00:07:07] I hired someone else. [00:07:08] We go to one carrier, I don't have that luxury anymore, do I? [00:07:11] No. [00:07:12] Right. [00:07:12] So I have a serious issue with that, number one. [00:07:15] Number two, when we're talking about this yard debris, they will pick it up [00:07:19] currently if you just put it up like, if I don't want to haul, if I cut some [00:07:24] small limbs and do some weeding and put it in a garbage bag, they'll pick it up. [00:07:28] If I cut down, I don't know, I took like a hibiscus tree out when I moved in. [00:07:34] Cut it up in, you know, branches like that long, wrapped it in a cord and put [00:07:40] it out by the garbage and they picked it up, okay? [00:07:42] What we're having right now with our yard debris is it's just insanely out of [00:07:47] whack as to what the initial purpose of our yard debris pickup was supposed to be [00:07:52] for, but we have now is, as we know, commercial landscapers coming in and [00:07:57] trimming a couple of palm trees and dumping everything in their flatbed on [00:08:00] any corner, and we have, I'm seeing this more and more, which absolutely blows my [00:08:04] mind, we have tree companies taking down entire trees and leaving them on site for [00:08:09] the city to pick up. [00:08:11] That's not what the service was ever about. [00:08:12] So you tell me if we say, okay, now we're going to do curbside, we're going to cut [00:08:15] a tree down, leave it at the driveway that the garbage carriers are going to pick [00:08:18] it up. [00:08:18] No, they don't have the means to pick it up and put it in the garbage truck unless [00:08:22] it's wrapped up in rope and organized nicely. [00:08:25] They're not going to come in like we do with a tractor and lift it up and throw it [00:08:28] in the garbage truck. [00:08:29] So those are the two big red flags I see. [00:08:31] I like the idea of having less trucks on the road, but you get one carrier in here [00:08:36] and they can do whatever the heck they want, you know, service drops, sorry, we're [00:08:40] all you got. [00:08:40] So those are my initial thoughts. [00:08:43] I'd like to discuss each one of these separately because I have a totally different [00:08:48] opinion about one or the other. [00:08:49] So pick one and let's stay on topic. [00:08:50] Let's talk about solid waste through an exclusive franchise. [00:08:56] I'm 100 percent against it. [00:08:57] And I'll give you one example of it. [00:08:59] I talked to Hernando County has one service for public and the councilman that I [00:09:07] talked to, or a commissioner, I guess he's up there, his number one complaint is [00:09:14] people calling him about waste pickup, trash pickup. [00:09:17] I don't want to put that in three years from now or next year. [00:09:20] I don't want to put it in the responsibility of this people right here to [00:09:25] have to monitor those calls. [00:09:28] I think that we shouldn't even be in that business of taking phone calls because [00:09:33] somebody's trash didn't get picked up. [00:09:37] So is that what we're starting with then? [00:09:39] Yes, let's start on that. [00:09:40] So this is whether to do the first that came up, the three year notice in order to [00:09:48] stimulate something. [00:09:49] Going to an exclusive type contract. [00:09:51] So my sense is I would agree that we shouldn't have an exclusive contract, but [00:09:57] I'm not so sure that the process that's being recommended is a bad one because it [00:10:02] forces the, it may force these vendors to be able to negotiate and speak with us. [00:10:08] I do have some background on this. [00:10:10] I think I shared that with you all before that I had made contact with the vendors [00:10:13] and I had been, when I worked here in the city, I had tried to help the city manager [00:10:19] in figuring out, working on some proposals. [00:10:22] So I'll share with you what I know, and that is that the big problem is, well, we need [00:10:34] more than one vendor, obviously, so we have coverage. [00:10:36] I've agreed with Chopper on that. [00:10:38] My sense is that the vendors would all be happy to have us assume the billing and [00:10:46] collection. [00:10:47] That's another subject. [00:10:49] That's another subject. [00:10:50] Okay. [00:10:50] Thanks for stopping me. [00:10:52] So multiple vendors is fine, but the question is, do we notice a three-year provision? [00:11:03] And I would say I'm open to do that with the hope that that isn't what we end up with. [00:11:13] My thoughts is that, you know, one's probably not a good idea because we'll end up having [00:11:17] problems, but my thoughts were, there's six providers, let's limit it to two. [00:11:22] Or three. [00:11:23] That way people have a choice, at least, of somebody else if they want to go to them. [00:11:29] J.D. [00:11:29] Parker's been bought by one of them, so they're not individual anymore. [00:11:33] Republic, I think, but I wouldn't swear to it. [00:11:35] There's a big 20-yard dumpster with somebody else's name on it right out in front of them. [00:11:40] Do you want to say... [00:11:42] I don't think it's Republic. [00:11:44] I think it's somebody else. [00:11:45] Could be. [00:11:45] Correct. [00:11:46] Our current providers? [00:11:47] Yes. [00:11:49] Yes. [00:11:50] Okay. [00:11:51] So, I don't think there's six, and I don't think there was five. [00:11:54] I think there's, like, four now, really, but maybe, I mean... [00:11:56] Well, one of the companies only does recycling, so there are five that do hauling. [00:12:02] Now with J.D. [00:12:03] Parker, maybe it's four. [00:12:04] On a quick side note, since we brought up J.D. [00:12:06] Parker, is there anything we can do to require them to move that huge, obnoxious dumpster [00:12:11] from in front of their building on 19th? [00:12:12] I mean, it just blows my mind, so I won't put that out there. [00:12:14] They don't, it's not J.D. [00:12:15] Parker anymore. [00:12:16] Well, whoever owns it. [00:12:17] I will look into it, and if not, we'll, we're working on an outside storage ordinance, which [00:12:23] would regulate that if we don't already have the tools. [00:12:26] I think they may be using it as... [00:12:27] They're called WasteProUSA now. [00:12:28] Yeah, it may be, they're using that as advertising. [00:12:32] From my... [00:12:34] To get the first, did you have anything else on the... [00:12:38] No, that was basically my thoughts, and we still haven't been in a position to, you know, [00:12:41] leverage better pricing, that kind of thing. [00:12:43] My thought on the single vendor is that, I don't know that that would work well, and I [00:12:51] think for the same reasons that you expressed and that Deputy Mayor Starkey did, having [00:12:57] multiple vendors, perhaps divvying up the city into zones, which I think was her second [00:13:06] option. [00:13:07] That would be against, that wouldn't help Jeff's problem. [00:13:10] It might, because if somebody, if a vendor just, and thinking out loud, because I, you [00:13:16] know, really hadn't given a lot of thought to it, but if a vendor in the North River [00:13:21] neighborhood just starts falling down, and, you know, coming in late in the evening or [00:13:30] something else, it would be fairly easy, if we've got the contract set up right, to tell [00:13:37] them, you know, you're on notice, and if it's not fixed, the guy in the next zone over [00:13:43] is going to have the contract for this zone. [00:13:45] I don't think we're in the trash hauling business. [00:13:47] I think they're in the trash hauling business, and I think that, you know, if, I think five [00:13:53] or six, whatever the number is, is too many in the city anyhow, but I'm kind of, Matt, [00:13:57] if, okay, we're putting it up in bid for three, in three years for three, three come in [00:14:02] here, so if you don't like one, you've still got two others you can go to. [00:14:05] That would make more sense than having just an unlimited number. [00:14:09] Why, when it's, I can pick my pickup up and register with the city and start hauling trash. [00:14:15] I was just about to say, if you and Matt and I got together, we could become, you know, [00:14:21] councilman's trash pickup, and we could go around with your trucks, and all of a sudden [00:14:26] there'd be another one. [00:14:27] There's another one up in Hudson Cole, I think it's called Seaside, it's not even here, and [00:14:30] I don't know why they would come knocking on our door to do it, too. [00:14:33] So you don't want Jeff and I to join in this thing? [00:14:35] Well, I just need the logistics, because I have our trucks. [00:14:41] You guys have to pick up at 6.30 in the morning, not 6.30 at night. [00:14:44] Jeff's not going to get much garbage in that golf cart. [00:14:48] I'm not sure what you drive, so. [00:14:49] I'm okay with two or three haulers, I just don't like the monopoly effect where you get [00:14:55] one person to carry the number, I think three would be a good number. [00:14:58] All right, well, that. [00:15:00] Maybe as opposed, and my first thought was the zones, but hearing what you're saying, [00:15:06] I could live with cutting it down, because it solves the same thing. [00:15:10] It doesn't get you down to a single truck in a particular neighborhood, [00:15:15] but it gets you down to half as many trucks as we've got now, which is a definite improvement, [00:15:21] and still gives you the ability to provide. [00:15:26] And it puts it up for bid, too, because then three out of the six or three out of five went in. [00:15:31] Yeah. [00:15:32] So following up on the issue that you raised, which is you don't want to be in the business, [00:15:36] I'm just going to say we need all the business we can get in our general fund. [00:15:41] This is a great revenue opportunity for us at limited additional effort by city staff [00:15:49] with great result for the vendors, because anything short of us billing every single home [00:15:56] is going to result in houses that are not on top of things picking them up. [00:16:02] I see people sneaking up and down my street putting garbage in other people's things. [00:16:06] I see garbage laying around. [00:16:08] We have these cleanup days. [00:16:09] We get tons of garbage, stuff that doesn't go out. [00:16:12] So I think there is a public purpose to us making sure that the garbage in our town is properly being, [00:16:18] you know, it's an important element. [00:16:21] You know, waste disposal, sewage, water. [00:16:24] Now, I'm with you that we don't want to get into that business, and I think the mayor hit on it, [00:16:30] which is a tight contract with everyone to say here are the rules, no 630 in the morning pickups, [00:16:37] because to Jeff's point, if he has this problem, so does everybody else in his neighborhood. [00:16:43] So you can switch. [00:16:44] We have times right now. [00:16:45] What's the time? [00:16:46] They were picking mine up at 6.30 p.m. [00:16:48] But the point is, if somebody gets outside the standards that we established for them, [00:16:54] it's only fair for the whole neighborhood that that bad service is being cured, [00:16:58] not that we have the right to switch. [00:17:00] I mean, we can cause everyone else to switch around. [00:17:03] 6 in the morning to 7 at night? [00:17:05] So I think that, you know, everything is a cost-benefit analysis, [00:17:09] and I think that it's worth having the cost-benefit analysis. [00:17:12] It may result that Chopper's right that it doesn't have a benefit, [00:17:16] but I think it's worth exploring because the vendors were excited at the opportunity for us [00:17:22] because they don't know when people move and leave [00:17:26] and if they move to another vendor or hauler or whether anybody's covering it. [00:17:31] And so there's a lot more revenue to be generated [00:17:34] and a lower price to be generated for our residents. [00:17:38] Yeah, because they certainly would save gas prices if they didn't have to drive the whole city. [00:17:42] May I ask a logistical question then as far as billing goes? [00:17:45] And apparently, on top of just the fee, the revenue fee for the city and with us doing the billing, [00:17:51] it sounds like another main reason you're proposing this is so that we can guarantee [00:17:57] that every occupied dwelling in the city of New Port Richey has garbage service, correct? [00:18:02] Yes, it is. [00:18:03] Okay, so as far as billing goes, currently if I'm a tenant, the water bill's in my name normally, right? [00:18:08] So who's ultimately responsible for garbage then? [00:18:12] Is it going to be the tenant or the owner of the property? [00:18:15] Because if the tenant moves in and just doesn't get garbage service and it turns into a pig's die, [00:18:19] then as far as the billing goes and us requiring it, is it on the tenant or the owner of the property? [00:18:24] It's a good question. [00:18:26] Currently, it would be the tenant or the owner of the property. [00:18:32] We are, though, considering making a change in our water ordinance [00:18:36] and asking you to consider that we make the property owner responsible for that, for the water service, [00:18:47] and that would mean then the trash service as well. [00:18:50] I think there's something to be said. [00:18:53] I hadn't really considered the fact that, you know, what number of these we're not getting [00:18:58] because they're not signing up for service, but it provides to me a dual advantage, [00:19:05] and I think we're on the second part of this discussion at this point, [00:19:11] one of which is it ensures that everybody has trash pickup, [00:19:16] but the second part is that the funds that are supposed to be coming to the city actually do come to the city, [00:19:27] and if we're billing, Crystal and I'll defer to you, [00:19:35] but I'm thinking it would be a lot easier for us to send out a combined water sewer bill with trash on it [00:19:44] and then figure out how to allocate that money to, say, three different vendors that are actually covering the city [00:19:54] as opposed to what we've got now where we've got five or six or however many there are this week [00:20:00] that are supposed to be sending checks in. [00:20:04] Right. Right now, we rely on the haulers to remit the franchise fee to us [00:20:09] based on what they're telling us they collected from our city residents. [00:20:13] It would be the reverse in this case where we would be collecting it [00:20:17] and we would be able to retain the franchise fee at that point [00:20:22] and then remit to them what's left minus an administrative fee that we would also charge. [00:20:29] I talked to the lady that used to own J.D. Parker a year or so ago, [00:20:35] and they paid the most in franchise fees but did not have the most customers, [00:20:39] so it was our mistake not to audit these guys because they're not paying their fair share. [00:20:49] Once again, a logistical question. [00:20:51] I use ABC hauling and then Sue. [00:20:53] My bill from the city, you collect for them, and then I switch to XYZ hauling. [00:21:00] How does that work then? [00:21:03] That would be up to the haulers to update their records [00:21:09] when providing us the franchise fee or the check each month. [00:21:15] Ideally, or in theory, your original hauler would not include [00:21:20] what was not collected from you on their own one month, and your new hauler would. [00:21:25] So the city, in theory, wouldn't see a loss in collecting that franchise fee. [00:21:29] Let's take it the other side of this. [00:21:31] If we're collecting the funds, then it would be up to, [00:21:34] if you're using ABC hauling today and switch to XYZ hauling, [00:21:39] it would be the responsibility of XYZ to contact us and say, [00:21:43] hey, we just picked up the Starkey house. [00:21:48] That's on them, then. [00:21:49] It's not extra work for our finance department is what I'm asking. [00:21:51] I think the easy work is to have the districts. [00:21:54] It's easier on the roads. [00:21:55] It's easier on everything, and it's more customers for everybody. [00:21:59] That's what made this interesting to the vendors, [00:22:02] because they're not collecting from everybody, [00:22:06] and all of the people in the city aren't paying. [00:22:09] So the idea to the vendors, which they liked, [00:22:12] was they can stay on up and down one street. [00:22:16] So the district approach would have the city just cutting a check every month, [00:22:20] not much administrative. [00:22:21] If that didn't happen, and if it was for you free to choose from who you wanted, [00:22:26] then obviously they'd have to have an indicator on every bill as to which, [00:22:31] like we have for meters, like different meter sizes, [00:22:34] you'd have to have an indicator on who the vendor was, [00:22:38] which would be programmable for you, but extra work. [00:22:42] Then I ask since Jeff switched from ABC to XYZ, [00:22:48] if he changed on the 2nd, he changed on the 5th, [00:22:51] he changed on the 25th, he changed on the 29th, [00:22:54] which guy gets the money? [00:22:57] We haven't worked out those specific details of it, so I couldn't answer that. [00:23:01] But they're legitimate questions, because like you said, even with districts, [00:23:04] I understand the benefit of a district. [00:23:05] If you're a hauler, you can just hit this street, that street, that street, I get it. [00:23:09] But then again, I'm once again as a customer monopolized, [00:23:12] because if I don't like the hauler in my district. [00:23:14] Well, we've already decided that we're not going that route. [00:23:17] No, well, three of us. [00:23:21] No, you were very adamant about what you wanted to do. [00:23:25] Those are my concerns. [00:23:27] We haven't come to any conclusion. [00:23:29] Well, three people have come up with three ideas. [00:23:31] But you're absolutely right, though. [00:23:33] If you do go to districts, you're assigning a hauler for that district. [00:23:37] I mean, you might be able to rotate them annually if you went that way, [00:23:41] but that wouldn't be productive. [00:23:43] So you're still resulting in the same thing that you're saying. [00:23:46] My point being, I see the benefits, [00:23:48] I don't see the cons, and the cons to me are outweighing the benefits. [00:23:51] I think every resident of this city should have good trash hauling. [00:23:55] I don't think that a bad service is beyond this city from maintaining [00:24:02] and having some oversight over. [00:24:05] I see your point, but it bounces between protecting the entrepreneurial part [00:24:11] and the free enterprise system. [00:24:14] And I certainly agree with Chopper 100%. [00:24:16] We don't want to get into the garbage hauling business, [00:24:18] but if there were districts and there were compliance requirements, [00:24:26] that hauler would be gone for everybody. [00:24:29] And that's a pretty good stick to have. [00:24:37] Gone in a week, gone in a month, gone in a year. [00:24:39] How long is that going to take? [00:24:43] My trash, I was out cleaning my truck two weeks ago or three weeks ago, [00:24:48] when did I tell you? [00:24:49] Two or three weeks ago, and they decided to take, on a Thursday, [00:24:52] they decided to take my trash and my collectibles and throw them in the same truck. [00:24:56] And I caught them. [00:24:58] So how long am I going to put up with that? [00:25:01] I'm not putting up with it. [00:25:03] On the second, I'm going to a different hauler. [00:25:05] If we've got a limited number of haulers that are dealing with the citywide [00:25:12] and something like that happens, you've still got the opportunity to say, [00:25:18] all right, ABC's not cutting it, I'm going to XYZ. [00:25:21] Well, that's what I'm saying, but when you do districts, you don't have that option. [00:25:24] Not if they're districts, no. [00:25:26] And honestly, there is a difference. [00:25:27] I mean, I guess I'm so stuck on the servicing because I work in such a competitive industry, [00:25:33] service is everything in my industry, and I've seen guys on my street dump garbage cans [00:25:38] and garbage fell out and they hopped on the back of the truck, kept on going. [00:25:41] There was garbage. [00:25:42] I come home, there's plastic bags in my yard. [00:25:44] And then I've seen garbage guys in my neighborhood where someone was, [00:25:49] a little old lady was hauling her garbage out and the guy ran up to her garage [00:25:52] and helped her and was sweet as can be and made sure every piece of garbage got in that truck. [00:25:56] So there is a different service level between companies. [00:26:00] There just is in any industry there's going to be. [00:26:02] There is. [00:26:03] Between drivers and between trucks and between everything. [00:26:06] So it's not a perfect world and not ever going to be one. [00:26:09] I like having the option to choose. [00:26:11] And I think we've come up with, and I hear it's going to cut half the trucks that are on the roads. [00:26:15] We've got to franchise these, which is supposedly the whole idea of that was to pay for the roads. [00:26:19] And I'm going to try and be negative, Nellie, here. [00:26:21] I'm not. [00:26:22] I'm just, I understand the benefits of why we're discussing this and looking into districts [00:26:26] or one hauler, and I understand that. [00:26:28] I'm just speaking my mind. [00:26:31] I'm willing to join your three, whoever they are, I'm not sure, and say, you know, [00:26:36] let's explore the mayor's concept of a minimal amount. [00:26:41] I don't know if we can bid this out to the top three and allow them to do it or not. [00:26:47] But also, Robert, these six haulers aren't all residential garbage haulers, are they? [00:26:53] No. [00:26:54] So let's talk about how many residential garbage and what do we have? [00:26:57] We've got some commercial haulers. [00:26:58] You have one that's commercial that just deals with dumpsters. [00:27:01] You have another one that is just commercial that deals with roll-offs, if you were doing construction, [00:27:06] those types of things. [00:27:07] Right. [00:27:08] And then we have a third one that purely just picks up the wilds community. [00:27:13] But they're residential. [00:27:14] But that's all they do. [00:27:15] They come into town and they pick up the wilds. [00:27:17] They're a district already, then, kind of, aren't they? [00:27:20] So then you have three. [00:27:22] You really only have three vendors, then, other than that. [00:27:25] Pretty much. [00:27:26] So we already have just three vendors. [00:27:27] They principally cover the city and they generate, just so you know, [00:27:32] about $120,000 a year in franchise fees collected. [00:27:37] All right. [00:27:38] Regarding the... [00:27:40] What are the three then? [00:27:41] Because I thought we had four or five that we approved. [00:27:44] We were talking about, I think, commercial. [00:27:46] Regarding commercial. [00:27:47] Commercial. [00:27:48] You've got some... [00:27:49] Some residentials in addition. [00:27:51] Jeff. [00:27:52] Regarding commercial hauling, I've had some of the restaurant bar owners [00:27:56] downtown ask me. [00:27:58] They want to recycle their beer bottles, their cans, [00:28:02] and they just don't know how to do it. [00:28:04] Like BJ and Natalie Cypher, who own Ordnance One, [00:28:07] Natalie is very into the environment and recycling. [00:28:10] And she literally will, like, put... [00:28:13] They don't have a lot. [00:28:14] You know, they have cans. [00:28:15] Most of what they serve is on tap. [00:28:17] But they do go through a lot of cans and whatnot as well. [00:28:19] And she'll put them in separate bags, put them in... [00:28:22] Like, they haul them to their house to get them recycled [00:28:24] and picked up at their own residence to recycle. [00:28:26] So she was asking me, [00:28:27] do we have any haulers that can set up a program to pick up recyclables [00:28:32] for our businesses, for our hospitality businesses? [00:28:35] Once Ahasien opens our restaurants, our bars, [00:28:38] do we have options to ask someone or look into it? [00:28:42] I'm sorry. [00:28:43] You did ask me about that, and that's all right. [00:28:46] And I assigned somebody to look into it, [00:28:48] but I don't have a report back from them yet. [00:28:50] But I'll probably have to let them know. [00:28:53] And, you know, somebody came up, [00:28:57] and it was at one of the more recent meetings, [00:29:00] had asked about why we're not requiring recycling [00:29:05] at some of the special events. [00:29:07] And, again, if we had a commercial hauler that was doing recycling [00:29:11] and could swing by the park on a Saturday during the event [00:29:16] and pick up there as well as at the businesses. [00:29:19] I think it sends a very positive image. [00:29:21] Like we're a growing urban city with, you know, we want to be a green city. [00:29:26] We have our urban gardening ordinance, [00:29:28] which got so much traction and press and whatnot. [00:29:31] And if we, you know, got in, just got that image for the city, [00:29:35] you know, we don't just throw away everything. [00:29:38] The Main Street Landing had a tour of that. [00:29:42] They have a bin for recycling on one side [00:29:46] and a bin for regular trash on the other. [00:29:48] And they drop it in, and every person is separating and putting it out. [00:29:52] That's their plan. [00:29:54] So they have a system in place with two separate chutes, [00:29:57] and it drops right down into the container. [00:30:00] That's awesome, but we've got to figure out a way, like, that's awesome, but just for, like, [00:30:03] once-a-gown restaurants and bars and what have you. [00:30:06] But it might be worth approaching the waste haulers specifically on that issue of the... [00:30:15] The county might already have one in place. [00:30:16] I've got their ordinance here, but I know that the Florida statute, when I was reading it, [00:30:21] calls out that now you have to have a recycled program for all of those types of classifications [00:30:28] that you're talking about, and it's as a municipality or the county, and because the haulers operate [00:30:35] under the county's program, I'll have to look and see if it's in there, but that should [00:30:40] be very easy to do. [00:30:42] It would definitely be worth formalizing. [00:30:44] When people come to a tourist development with, you know, some kind of event, CHASC [00:30:47] or whatever, they're in their paperwork to get money from the tourist development board [00:30:52] that has to have a recycled program. [00:30:55] It's out there. [00:30:56] It's whether we implement it here. [00:30:58] Correct. [00:31:00] Any other thoughts on this part of the discussion? [00:31:03] Well, just from a consensus standpoint, if I'm reading the rest of it right, there's [00:31:08] a willingness to consider the billing side of things, a disinterest in single hauler [00:31:18] and disinterest in districts. [00:31:22] I agree with what you say. [00:31:25] Yep. [00:31:26] Is that what everybody else is saying? [00:31:28] Yep. [00:31:29] Yeah, you could probably twist my arm and get me to go with the districts, but I don't [00:31:32] feel real strongly about that, but I can see where anything that cuts down the number of [00:31:37] these going through the city would be a problem. [00:31:39] Yeah, well, I don't think you're cutting down the number of vendors particularly considering [00:31:42] what we just heard. [00:31:43] There's only three really citywide vendors that we have now, so. [00:31:46] Well, and currently you have an open market, too, so you either go with one or... [00:31:52] Oh, right. [00:31:53] You can't borrow the other ones that would want to come in that that next cycle of applications [00:31:59] would qualify. [00:32:00] The one that goes into the wilds might end up going to bid part of the city. [00:32:05] They had enough trucks, which... [00:32:07] I'm sorry. [00:32:08] No, I'm not. [00:32:09] Go ahead. [00:32:10] Go ahead. [00:32:11] No. [00:32:12] No, no, no. [00:32:13] Go ahead. [00:32:14] And from what we understand, they're a smaller hauler, so in all likelihood they don't have [00:32:19] the equipment. [00:32:22] What about the third piece of this, the yard debris? [00:32:26] It seems... [00:32:27] Before we go on, just... [00:32:28] Okay. [00:32:29] You were talking about consensus. [00:32:30] I personally am against single haulers in districts. [00:32:33] Are you for or against single haulers in districts? [00:32:36] Against single haulers in districts. [00:32:37] You're for possibly looking into it. [00:32:39] You can have your arm twisted. [00:32:41] But I think getting a... [00:32:42] I don't think a single hauler is going to work for the same reasons that you had. [00:32:46] Possibly you and Councilman Altman are possibly okay with districts or no? [00:32:50] I am. [00:32:51] But I don't... [00:32:52] It's not a break your deal for me. [00:32:54] I'm more interested in getting everybody... [00:32:55] Before we go on to the next item, just trying to figure out where we're at. [00:32:56] Councilman Murphy, are you for or against districts? [00:32:57] Against. [00:32:58] So it's three against two, four as far as districts go? [00:33:04] I don't feel very strongly about it one way or the other on the districts. [00:33:08] That's a good... [00:33:09] That's what the work sessions are for, so I'm happy with that. [00:33:11] So landscape debris? [00:33:13] Landscape debris. [00:33:15] You know, I... [00:33:16] And back when I was just a council member back in the early 2008-2009 period, we brought [00:33:25] up the question as we were trying to clip back every expense we could to keep the city [00:33:31] afloat and the discussion came up of saving... [00:33:37] At that time we were talking about $100,000 as opposed to $200,000 by just doing away [00:33:43] with the yard debris and telling everybody, put it with your trash cans, and it was sort [00:33:49] of like the city equivalent of the third rail of federal stuff that you're committing suicide [00:33:56] by agreeing to do it. [00:33:59] I have an idea to share with you, which is that many people in the city don't need this. [00:34:07] The wilds doesn't need it. [00:34:10] A lot of these newer subdivisions don't need it. [00:34:14] The need is in the... [00:34:16] The need for the trash pickup is in the old town, the Tree City, USA. [00:34:21] I'm on three and a half lots. [00:34:22] My neighbors all use the pile at mine and it gets monstrous. [00:34:27] So I would propose that it would only be fair for those of us who use the service to be... [00:34:35] Or who want to use it or need to, to A, to pay for it. [00:34:39] But the thing I really learned was that the yard debris goes to Shady Hills, which is [00:34:48] 20 miles away from here. [00:34:49] I don't know whether there's a closer one to take yard debris, a private... [00:34:52] There's a few private places to dump stuff. [00:34:55] That's why everybody's dumping it, because that's a 20 minute drive, it's a lot of gas [00:35:01] back and forth. [00:35:03] And back to the environmental side, the Windrove Composting, it was very popular when we first [00:35:08] started it. [00:35:10] The mulch is being used. [00:35:12] I think that we need to relook at it and have it as an on-call service where there's a fee [00:35:19] for it and we can fund that 200,000 through the franchise fee, which was what the discussion [00:35:25] was with the franchise fee, was that it was going to help to offset some of those costs. [00:35:31] As well as having... [00:35:35] The problem is, is the stuff sits out there for a long time. [00:35:38] And Robert, you know the deal on it, but sometimes you have to marshal resources from wherever [00:35:44] to attack a big issue or problem. [00:35:47] So when a hurricane comes, everybody else comes and helps with the debris pickup, and [00:35:52] when it's not debris, you reallocate them. [00:35:57] Would it help if we allowed the commercial yard companies to drop their tree trimmings [00:36:05] and stuff at the compost area? [00:36:08] We would need to do some homework on that. [00:36:11] The way I read the statute years ago when we looked into that, was the city would have [00:36:18] to require a special license and have an official site that would be available for business. [00:36:27] So to speak, for haulers to be able to come there. [00:36:31] Right now, we just collect... [00:36:32] I think he said a word that I really liked, and that would be that they would call for [00:36:37] a pickup. [00:36:38] Who would call for a pickup? [00:36:40] An individual that had some yard debris. [00:36:43] And pay for it. [00:36:44] Yeah. [00:36:45] And pay... [00:36:46] Now, I don't know about the pay for it issue, but call. [00:36:48] So you still have your five or eight, seven or eight zones of whatever, probably could [00:36:53] do with four if the people called in instead of having to pick up the dumped stuff. [00:36:57] But you put it on your own property, you give us a call, we come get it. [00:37:02] And we make a trip around about once every month or six weeks. [00:37:07] I don't know if there's a fee or not, I'll debate that right now, but I think we shut [00:37:12] it down by just saying you put it on your own yard and you give us a call when you need [00:37:15] it. [00:37:16] And initially, we'll go ahead and pick it up, because I think it'll drop down to about [00:37:21] a third of what we're doing right now. [00:37:24] Particularly if we can get the commercial guys... [00:37:27] If we can get the commercial guys to drop it at Pine Hill. [00:37:30] Well, the commercial guys aren't involved anymore. [00:37:33] They're not... [00:37:34] You can't dump it. [00:37:35] If you bump it in somebody's yard, somebody's... [00:37:38] You come and take a couple of palm trees down here, you're not letting the commercial guy [00:37:40] dump in his yard. [00:37:41] He's dumping it at a neighborhood spot. [00:37:44] That's not allowed to be done that. [00:37:45] There's no more neighborhood spots. [00:37:46] It's in your own yard. [00:37:47] You let us know, and we'll come pick it up. [00:37:49] There you go. [00:37:50] My whole neighborhood uses my pile. [00:37:54] We've got some community piles in my neighborhood. [00:37:57] And they know that... [00:37:58] Because if you look on the site, when they're going to come, what week they're going to [00:38:01] come into their particular zone. [00:38:04] I wish so much that your idea was the answer, because I've been looking for the answer since [00:38:09] I've been on council. [00:38:10] I was hoping one of you new guys was going to come in here and say, I got this figured [00:38:12] out, because we haven't been able to figure it out in six years, and it's getting worse [00:38:15] and worse and worse. [00:38:16] I don't think that's going to work, because I think their phone's going to be ringing [00:38:19] They take a huge truck, and a huge backhoe. [00:38:23] I just imagine two houses call, OK, we're going to load up the backhoe and go pick up [00:38:27] one guy's thing. [00:38:28] You have to do it by territories, right? [00:38:29] Right. [00:38:30] Well, that's the same thing. [00:38:31] That would still be the same thing. [00:38:32] Call for a container. [00:38:33] Call for a container, Sam. [00:38:34] It's not going to be long. [00:38:35] Get that big truck and that big tractor, and they go pick up one load of debris. [00:38:39] No, it's going to still be in the same zone. [00:38:41] We have seven zones or something, eight zones. [00:38:44] And while we're on this, I don't know if you all know this, the only reason I know is I [00:38:47] know two people keep their boats at the storage facility. [00:38:49] But I got emails, phone calls, not trying to throw the city under the bus or some part [00:38:56] of the city, but this pile on Pine Hill, I mean, it was never that high. [00:39:01] I can't remember. [00:39:02] It's higher every year, higher and higher and higher, right? [00:39:04] So we have a boat, an RV storage facility, and the pile's gotten so high that when they [00:39:10] move it, and I don't know what causes it, all this dust goes over, and I had pictures [00:39:13] I sent to Debbie. [00:39:15] These $100,000-plus bay boats and $100,000-plus RVs, absolutely covered with mulch dust, covered. [00:39:23] I mean, I would have went insane if it was an item that I personally owned, and we didn't [00:39:29] have that before. [00:39:30] And I assume I treated it because of the size of the pile, Robert, or the sprinkler wasn't [00:39:34] working, or they said it wasn't the first time it happened, and I saw the person in [00:39:38] the picture with me, and they sent me pictures, and it was a mess. [00:39:42] I think the bottom line is times are changing, and back in the day when we were the only [00:39:46] one on that site performing that type of activity, we didn't have to worry about those types [00:39:51] of things, and then, of course, they start building all the buildings all around us now, [00:39:57] and so now we're surrounded. [00:39:59] So whether you use the water to kind of keep that dust down, or in that day that it happened, [00:40:05] we had that little storm come in, almost like it was a tropical storm, and the winds were [00:40:10] high, and by the time the contractor shut it down, it was already all over the place. [00:40:15] I don't want to blame you personally, but that storm has been there about 10 years. [00:40:18] So that happened during the grinding processes when that happened, which is how many weeks [00:40:25] out of the year? [00:40:26] It lasts a week, and we end up probably averaging maybe two weeks a year. [00:40:30] We've planted trees and stuff that were, you know, it's not going to take care of the problem [00:40:35] now, but if we remain there, hopefully they'll get mature enough to be able to hide the operation [00:40:42] as well as prevent those types of things from happening. [00:40:45] Can we currently site a property owner that has an oak tree, or like that tree, your next [00:40:49] door neighbor, Mayor, the tree that was taken down and left on site for the city to come? [00:40:53] That's not what this, correct me if I'm wrong, when this system was put in the forest, it [00:41:00] wasn't hauled trees away that a professional tree company comes and cuts down and leaves [00:41:04] on the property. [00:41:05] It was for landscape debris, for weeds, for trimming your hedges, for things like that. [00:41:10] You can't fit in a garbage can, right? [00:41:11] Correct. [00:41:12] It was just for regular maintenance. [00:41:13] So if someone has a tree that's cut down on their property, and they call the city, what [00:41:16] do we tell them? [00:41:17] We'll come get it? [00:41:18] Because apparently that's what we're doing. [00:41:19] There's a size that they wouldn't pick up, if I recall. [00:41:21] Right. [00:41:22] What we've done is I sent a draft ordinance, the existing ordinance that we have, I sent [00:41:27] over to Ms. Mance to review that kind of changes a lot of language to maybe we can tighten [00:41:33] that and take care of some of those things. [00:41:36] I still think if people don't have a central spot to put it, then the landscapers aren't [00:41:41] going to come dump it. [00:41:42] They're not going to, you know, and if you're going to have somebody come and trim a few [00:41:46] trees and you see, it goes out there and you say, hey, this wasn't all from your lot, and [00:41:50] you put a note that this is not acceptable at the person's house, not buying them or... [00:41:54] Unfortunately, we have residents that don't care, as long as it's not on their property, [00:41:57] they could give a hoot where they dump it, because if you go look at Jasmine Park on [00:41:59] the river, there's a debris pile there right now, and there has been. [00:42:04] We've sent letters out to the residents. [00:42:05] The residents in our neighborhood take their landscape debris and go dump it between the [00:42:08] sidewalk and the street of one of our city parks, so it's insane to me. [00:42:15] Is there any potential for us to, because of the unsightliness, because that's part [00:42:20] of the issue, and we just got done talking about garbage and getting that rid of, so [00:42:24] now we've got this. [00:42:26] I'm telling you, though, it's us in the state streets, you on the other side, and all of [00:42:31] the old town that has the trees, they're having this problem. [00:42:34] If you're in sunny... [00:42:38] Many places that don't. [00:42:40] From a fairness standpoint, if I lived in those neighborhoods, I would probably be saying, [00:42:45] this is not a service that I need, but as the mayor said, and it came up back in my [00:42:50] day a long time ago, and there was a great, what am I going to do? [00:42:55] You can't... [00:42:56] The wind blows the tree branches down, palm trunks, palm fronds, you can wrap them all [00:43:01] up with twine, but you get a bad storm on a big lot, and you're going to have a pile [00:43:09] of stuff. [00:43:10] And I've got... [00:43:11] After a tropical storm or something. [00:43:12] But I've hired a tree company. [00:43:13] Oh, any storm. [00:43:14] Hired a tree company to come in and pick a tree down, and they leave it there and expect [00:43:16] us to pick it up. [00:43:17] No, they shouldn't. [00:43:18] I've got a debris pile sitting on one side of my driveway, and I will guarantee you, [00:43:24] that's all not from my yard. [00:43:27] Because people see the pile, and they will bring stuff in from neighboring houses. [00:43:35] And I never see them do it, of course. [00:43:38] But I guarantee you, when the pile gets bigger, and I haven't been out doing yard work, I'm [00:43:43] pretty sure it's not mine. [00:43:45] It's like Shawshank Redemption. [00:43:46] They just drop it in their pocket, and they won't find it. [00:43:49] What about bringing the county into this discussion? [00:43:52] Because, frankly, we are so far away from a reasonable place to take yard debris to [00:44:00] begin with. [00:44:01] And the mulching program has been successful, do we need to relocate it? [00:44:06] Is it possible we could relocate it over to Indiana, or are we not allowed to use that [00:44:11] site anymore? [00:44:12] Are we reaching a point where we could actually do some stuff on the surface there? [00:44:17] It's still an active permit. [00:44:20] We haven't been able to apply for closure yet. [00:44:23] The methane levels are still at a point to where it's active. [00:44:28] Well, it seems to me that hauling debris to Shady Hills is about the worst environmental [00:44:37] thing that you can do. [00:44:38] I mean, you lose the composting, and you burn a whole heck of a lot of gas. [00:44:45] But if we charge the commercial vendors to drop, they'd probably be happy. [00:44:50] I don't know, again, how much more business we would entertain, but I think it's a good [00:45:00] It's a good product, and we ought to try to figure out how to sell it. [00:45:03] I think if you go in that direction, though, now you've added another set of trucks on [00:45:07] another day because they're not supposed to mix, just like recycling, you're going to [00:45:13] have to pick another day to where that private hauler comes around and all he's doing is [00:45:17] picking up the piles of yardage that you have. [00:45:19] Well, they have to deliver it to you. [00:45:20] Yeah. [00:45:21] But if these are... [00:45:22] They would deliver it to you. [00:45:23] If these are landscape companies and they can drop it there, you know, and maybe we [00:45:28] talk to the county about doing some sort, using it as a transfer station for yard debris. [00:45:34] Correct me if I'm wrong, what you're proposing, I think I'm on board with it, is if we have [00:45:39] the space... [00:45:40] So what they're doing right now, we've got commercial landscapers, once again, they'll [00:45:43] come trim a palm tree and dump 10 palm trees' worth of trimmings off at the site. [00:45:49] They trim the palm tree at the neighbor's yard, right? [00:45:50] Or in my driveway. [00:45:51] So instead of them dropping it off in just any pickup site around the city, hey, we'll [00:45:56] take it, but you need to bring it here. [00:45:57] So stop dropping it all over our city, come here, we'll charge you a minimal fee. [00:46:01] We have space for that on Pine Hill or no? [00:46:03] Busting at the seams now. [00:46:05] Yeah. [00:46:06] So you don't... [00:46:07] And also, if you do something like that, ABC that never comes into town says, oh, yeah, [00:46:11] now I don't have to go out to Springville, I'll just come by and dump it in the city [00:46:15] for five bucks, and that saves me, you know, 20 bucks in gas. [00:46:19] Well, you know, if it was economically viable for us to do, that's why I mentioned the county, [00:46:26] this is a lot of the stuff is coming in from the county. [00:46:29] I tried to follow somebody, but they were too quick with their big trailer, I guess, [00:46:33] or I was too slow. [00:46:34] But, you know, they're coming in to dump it. [00:46:37] It's not all our city residents either that this is happening. [00:46:39] But if these were coming in on the utility trailers and stuff like that, and then we're [00:46:45] there and we can fill up whatever the biggest dumpster you can get, a 40 yard or whatever, [00:46:53] if they can go and tip at the county... [00:46:57] They're doing this because they don't want to spend the money. [00:47:01] I understand, but if we had the ability then to get it transported out to the Resource [00:47:08] Recovery Center and let them burn the stuff, that would cut down on the amount of it that [00:47:13] we seem to collect, because we've got more than we can mulch now. [00:47:20] So it's too popular of a program, I guess, huh? [00:47:24] It has been very popular. [00:47:26] It's so hard to catch people, you know, I call them, who do I text, I text you or Robert, [00:47:31] you or... [00:47:32] And, you know, there's a landscape company right next to the vacant lot, you know, or [00:47:37] Montomere's office in the vacant lot. [00:47:39] The guy put up orange plastic fencing, which looks horrible, the guy who owns that vacant [00:47:44] lot, because people are just throwing their landscape there. [00:47:46] As I'm driving by in the house on the other side, the landscape company, no letters on [00:47:52] the side, just a white beat up pickup truck and a huge flatbed, just dumping it all right [00:47:57] there. [00:47:58] And I call Robert and Eric Jay, and Robert got out there in like five minutes, they were [00:48:01] awesome, they just were able, they were nearby, got out there and the guy's like, hey, we [00:48:04] just trimmed all those trees. [00:48:06] There's no way to prove, you know what I mean? [00:48:08] Even we caught him, I caught him dumping off his flatbed, I guarantee you that stuff was [00:48:13] there and he just added to it from the house there, but dumped it all, it's like impossible [00:48:18] to catch him, it really is. [00:48:20] That particular case, Matthew Potter is the owner of that lot, and I think that he's had [00:48:25] trouble with both vagrants as well as neighborhood feud issue, or whatever it was that stuff [00:48:33] was being thrown across. [00:48:34] That's why I think if you keep it on your own and you schedule a pickup with the city, [00:48:39] then you're not going to let the landscaper dump his stuff on your yard. [00:48:43] It's not a matter of let, unless you're going to set up security, in my case on my driveway, [00:48:52] there is no way to catch these people. [00:48:54] We've set up security cameras in the river, what's the park down on Bellevue, we haven't [00:48:59] been able to catch them. [00:49:00] We've got game cameras tied up to palm trees, we still can't catch them. [00:49:05] It's a... [00:49:06] How's that not working? [00:49:07] I guess you can't get the, I don't know, license plate, or? [00:49:12] I don't know about it. [00:49:16] It's a combination of several items. [00:49:18] A lot of times the trucks aren't identified, the trailer blocks the plate, they know how [00:49:23] to get in at the right angle, they see the camera, they in-out, they dump the bed, and [00:49:28] they're on their way. [00:49:29] I was talking to you, and you're asking me directly, I don't know about cameras, this [00:49:35] is the first time I'm hearing about it. [00:49:38] Just to start a... [00:49:39] Those cameras are being watched at the police department, right? [00:49:44] They are. [00:49:45] When they see them pull up, start dumping. [00:49:51] Not the hunting cameras, the hunting cameras are the ones that Brian sets up as well. [00:49:57] The game cameras take pictures every time motion is detected, and they're reviewed every [00:50:02] morning if we have an issue, then we report it. [00:50:06] It looks like we've got an intractable problem without a whole lot of good solutions right [00:50:11] now, but if you guys can come up with any way to make this work, to cut down on the [00:50:18] amount that we're having to spend to pick up this stuff. [00:50:23] I'm kind of like Chopper's idea of having it be on your own property, and I would like [00:50:31] to introduce the thought of the city putting out containers. [00:50:35] We tell people, this is cleanup day, this is the day to clean up. [00:50:40] For most people that do their own yard, that don't have a service, because that's the other [00:50:43] thing we didn't mention, if you have a service, then it's not even a requirement and an issue, [00:50:50] but if you don't, you try to do it yourself. [00:50:54] Is it possible to put a container out there, Robert, that doesn't cause you to dig up the [00:50:58] grass and just use something and dump it, or get a hauling service that saves you the [00:51:04] staff that will be part of what we do with our garbage that says, we want to recycle [00:51:09] our stuff, so we've got this recycling program. [00:51:13] So when you're getting ready to rake your yard, I mean, I've got three and a half lots, [00:51:19] so that's more than the average bear, and you've got a larger property as well. [00:51:23] When all those trees drop their leaves, it's a two or three times a year, it's just a kick [00:51:30] your butt and go out there and do it for two or three days. [00:51:33] Other than that, even putting it in a bag isn't a big issue, but there are, per residence, [00:51:39] what do you think, three or four times a year that you would have that large of a collection [00:51:44] of stuff other than... [00:51:45] You wouldn't be able to put it in your regular trash? [00:51:47] You couldn't get in your trash? [00:51:50] So maybe... [00:51:51] How do they get it to the pickup site then? [00:51:53] You don't have to drop it? [00:51:54] No, I'm just saying if we dropped a container at a house or something and said, you know, [00:51:58] here, you know... [00:51:59] Just call in and say, pick it up. [00:52:02] Or call in and pick it up. [00:52:03] Robert, may I ask your thoughts on what Chopper's proposing? [00:52:09] I just don't think that we have a grip on it now as far as enforcement and being able [00:52:15] to catch these people, and I just don't think that even if you tried doing that, that we [00:52:20] would solve the problem. [00:52:21] I still think you're going to have those people coming in and dumping where they want to. [00:52:24] They're going to dump in the alleys. [00:52:26] You're going to have some areas like Bellevue where the people have really nice yards. [00:52:30] They don't want the yard debris sitting on their front lawns that are manicured, so they [00:52:36] have these piles that they make. [00:52:38] That encourages the illegal dumping. [00:52:40] You have the people in town that live in the alleys that they don't want to put their yard [00:52:44] debris in the front yards. [00:52:45] They want to put it back in the alley. [00:52:48] That promotes illegal dumping, and I think that even if you had the people following [00:52:53] the rules, until you were able to start some type of consistent enforcement with these [00:52:58] contractors and what they're doing, I think you'd be fighting a losing battle. [00:53:03] And I really do want to find a solution. [00:53:06] I'm not trying to say we can't. [00:53:08] Any response to the container idea? [00:53:11] The container idea, I just don't know how many. [00:53:14] That's a lot of containers, too. [00:53:16] I mean, because if you think about it, if leaves are falling a certain time of year [00:53:20] and you've got everybody out there doing the same type of function, you probably would [00:53:25] be better off to do an outreach program and let them know, okay, we're going to be in [00:53:29] the North River neighborhood this week picking out the leaves and put your leaves all out [00:53:35] there in the curb and we'll be by to pick them up. [00:53:38] Talk to that guy so we can do districts of leaf falling. [00:53:41] Mr. Cain, do you have the solution? [00:53:43] You're back there. [00:53:44] It's in there quiet. [00:53:45] You got a solution for us? [00:53:47] There are so many things I wanted to say. [00:53:50] Get him to the microphone. [00:53:54] Come on up and talk to us. [00:53:55] You're the only resident here. [00:53:56] We appreciate you coming. [00:54:01] The short answer to that is no. [00:54:03] I don't have a solution. [00:54:08] I up the alley from where I live. [00:54:10] There's a big vacant lot. [00:54:12] For a long, long time, that's always been a common dumping ground. [00:54:17] I have caught people. [00:54:19] When I do, I run up the alley and I tell them it's a $5,000 fine and if I catch them here [00:54:26] again, I'm going to turn their plate in and that they can't dump. [00:54:30] They always get all excited and they leave. [00:54:32] For the most part, I never see them in the neighborhood again because they don't want [00:54:35] to risk a $5,000 fine. [00:54:41] The only thing I can say to that is if the cameras are placed, I don't understand why [00:54:47] the hunting cameras aren't working because if they're placed, they have to come up the [00:54:51] alley. [00:54:52] If you have two of them, they come in either way. [00:54:53] We should be able to get either a good pictorial of if not the license plate, a business name, [00:55:01] something. [00:55:02] Once we do get someone, and I kind of hate to put it this way, but you almost have to [00:55:08] set an example. [00:55:12] Once the word gets out there that New Port Richey isn't going to tolerate that and that [00:55:17] the fine is hefty and that they are going to enforce it, you're going to see that get [00:55:21] discouraged to some degree. [00:55:25] However, I don't have an answer. [00:55:29] I wish I did. [00:55:31] I know one thing. [00:55:32] I do enjoy the service. [00:55:34] I always have, and I do more now that I'm retired because I'm working out of my yard [00:55:40] all day long. [00:55:41] Today, I must have dumped about five, easily just five bucketfuls of leaves and things [00:55:54] I raked up and cleaned up. [00:55:56] I like that because if I had to try and depend on a hauler, it would be ridiculous. [00:56:01] It enables me to keep my property the way I like it to look. [00:56:05] That's important to me. [00:56:07] Some of the things I did want to remark on, I respectfully disagree with the maker of [00:56:18] this. [00:56:21] The idea of one hauler in town is not going to work. [00:56:24] I think it's a really bad idea. [00:56:25] I also am a big proponent for free enterprise, and I think that really flies in the face [00:56:31] of free enterprise. [00:56:33] One of the things, you know, and we see this going on now in other areas such as cable [00:56:38] companies. [00:56:39] Everybody's scratching their head wondering what happened to our antitrust laws, so now [00:56:43] you have very little choice. [00:56:45] You have two bad choices. [00:56:46] You either go with one or you go with the other because you have no one else. [00:56:50] As far as residential goes, I don't think we have more than three haulers for residential. [00:56:55] Each company only has so many trucks, so if you had one company, that company's going [00:57:00] to have to buy more trucks because now they've got to take care of an entire city, so I don't [00:57:04] think that's a good idea. [00:57:06] You're going to find that to be problematic, so at least now it's split up. [00:57:10] We do have times, okay, there are times where trucks are not supposed to be in our city [00:57:16] picking up, and I've in the past taken pictures and had that enforced. [00:57:21] It was with a different city manager. [00:57:23] I don't think you were here at the time, and sent photos in where they were out there 430 [00:57:28] in the morning emptying dumpsters and creating noise and havoc. [00:57:33] I don't think it's a bad system as it sits. [00:57:35] I think the object was revenue to some degree, but I really think the system as it is now [00:57:43] is a good system. [00:57:45] You might want to limit the amount of haulers, but then maybe not because, as I said, we [00:57:50] only have three residential. [00:57:52] The rest is commercial, so I really had to get that out, but as far as the, you know, [00:58:01] I think you would have a revolution if you ever stopped the yard debris because everyone [00:58:07] really likes that. [00:58:09] That was the conclusion we came to back in 2008, 2009, that there would be people here [00:58:13] with torches and pitchforks, and we'd wind up getting... [00:58:16] You know, we want people to do it. [00:58:18] We want people to keep their houses. [00:58:20] You know, that's a struggle in itself, isn't it? [00:58:23] I mean, to try and get people to do what they should to make the city look nice, and so [00:58:29] it's an incentive, and it may be costly, but I, and even if you had just a few haulers, [00:58:39] I wouldn't want to be tying my bills with my city bills. [00:58:44] My water bill is one thing, and I also switched haulers, by the way. [00:58:50] I went to J.D. Parker, who they sold the company, it's true, but I understand they're still [00:58:56] running it for that hauler, and the reason I switched was I was getting awful service [00:59:04] from the other company. [00:59:05] We're taking, leaving garbage, throwing cans, leaving them out in the street, so once you [00:59:10] have one hauler, now you've taken my incentive to act right away because I am the exclusive. [00:59:18] So, sorry I don't have a solution, Jeff, but... [00:59:22] Thank you, John. [00:59:24] Anything else before we... [00:59:27] I don't have anything else, Mr. Mayor. [00:59:29] Anybody? [00:59:31] In that case, we'll adjourn this, and we will come back down here in about 30 minutes for [00:59:36] the regular meeting.

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3. 3Adjournment