On the agenda

1. 1Call to Order - Roll Call▶ 0:00
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   Interlocal Service Boundary Agreement

   discussed

   Council held a work session to discuss whether to pursue an Interlocal Service Boundary Agreement with Pasco County under Florida Statutes Chapter 171, as an alternative to annexation for providing services such as public safety, fire/EMS, water/sewer, roads, parks, and stormwater. After extensive discussion of fire/EMS transport limitations, road/gas tax history, parks, and library services, council directed the City Manager to begin informal discussions with the county administrator and bring back more information; no resolution was adopted at this meeting.

   • direction:Council directed the City Manager to have informal/preliminary discussions with the Pasco County administrator about potential interlocal service boundary topics and report back, rather than immediately moving forward with a formal resolution of intent. (none)

   📍Gulf Harbors📍Highway 19📍Massachusetts (fire station)📍Station 19 by the old Kmart📍Van Doren and Leisure Lane👤Chris👤Commissioner Wells👤Mr. Altman👤Mr. Driscoll👤Ms. Manz#CRA (Community Redevelopment Agency) boundaries#Florida Statutes Chapter 171#Interlocal Service Boundary Agreement#Local option gas tax#Mutual aid agreements#Pasco County#Resolution of intent#Zephyrhills interlocal planning agreement

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   [00:00:18] The first and only item on the agenda is a discussion about interlocal service boundary [00:00:27] agreements. [00:00:28] Ms. Manz. [00:00:29] Thank you, Mr. Mayor. [00:00:30] The purpose of the discussion this evening relates to local government boundaries, and [00:00:38] rather than annexation or contraction, this is a mechanism afforded to us through Florida [00:00:45] statutes as an alternate means of providing municipal services. [00:00:53] In the case of the application of this tool, governments jointly determine the most efficient [00:01:02] and effective manner in which to provide services, and the reason that they do this is to promote [00:01:11] sensible boundaries that reduce the cost of service and avoid duplication. [00:01:19] As part of an interlocal service agreement, many areas of public service can be addressed, [00:01:26] but the issues concerning service delivery most typically include public safety, fire [00:01:33] and emergency medical services, water and waste water, road ownership, construction [00:01:39] and maintenance, conservation and parks and recreation, and stormwater management and [00:01:46] drainage. [00:01:48] In order to determine if it's appropriate to go forward with such action, typically [00:02:00] the steps involve identifying a municipal service area as well as identifying an area [00:02:11] in the unincorporated county. [00:02:14] For the purposes of discussion this evening, I've placed a map at all of your places so [00:02:20] that you could see clearly the areas of the city, and as part of the discussion I'm certain [00:02:30] that we'll identify the local government responsible for providing service and then the funding [00:02:37] of the service within either the municipal service area or the unincorporated service [00:02:44] area. [00:02:47] With the city council at the conclusion of deliberation this evening determines that [00:02:55] it's in the city's best interest to pursue an interlocal service agreement with Pasco [00:03:02] County, you would be advising me to place it on a future city council agenda. [00:03:11] The formal action would be a resolution of intent, which is the first step in the process [00:03:18] of entering into negotiations for service within a predetermined service area. [00:03:27] And I have asked Mr. Driscoll this evening to talk to you a little bit about the process [00:03:35] involved in establishing an interlocal service boundary agreement. [00:03:41] Mr. Driscoll. [00:03:42] All right, thank you very much, and I'll be pretty brief. [00:03:46] It's all statutory, it all falls under Chapter 171, and the city manager provided you all [00:03:51] a copy of the statute in your package. [00:03:55] I'll give you the summary of what needs to be done. [00:03:59] The ultimate resolution of the issues is incorporated into an interlocal service boundary [00:04:05] agreement. [00:04:07] That gets started by, as the city manager said, our initiation of a resolution which [00:04:13] will establish the boundary area that you would like, which needs to be shown by a map [00:04:18] or legal description, and the issues that are subject to negotiation. [00:04:23] The city manager, in her memo, outlined the issues that you can consider for such an interlocal [00:04:30] service agreement, which include public safety, fire, water, road ownership, conservation, [00:04:37] etc. [00:04:38] So, once you initiate that resolution and you designate what it is that you want the [00:04:43] county to consider, then the county has 60 days to respond to that resolution with their [00:04:50] own resolution, which is considered the responding resolution, and then there's another 60-day [00:04:55] period where the two agencies negotiate the terms of the agreement, and if an agreement [00:05:02] is reached, then both agencies approve that agreement by virtue of an ordinance. [00:05:08] The term of the agreement can be for 20 years or less, and at the conclusion of the 20 years [00:05:13] it can be renewed through the same process. [00:05:18] It requires the consideration of a number of issues. [00:05:22] As the city manager said, the area that will be serviced has to be delineated. [00:05:27] You also have to address a number of other issues that are provided by the statute. [00:05:32] I won't go into all of those, but eventually those will all have to be addressed and or [00:05:37] can be addressed in the interlocal service boundary agreement. [00:05:43] And I think that's really all you need to know at this stage, so what we would really [00:05:48] need is some direction from you going forward as to whether to come back with such a resolution [00:05:54] and what area and what issues you would like to address in that resolution. [00:05:58] Can I ask a question? [00:05:59] Do we have anything going with them now? [00:06:03] Yes. [00:06:05] Water and sewer. [00:06:06] In response to the question, we do provide water and sewer services outside of the municipal [00:06:16] boundary currently, and that is the only service that we provide outside of our boundary. [00:06:24] If there's a situation, do we interact with them with fire and... [00:06:31] Certainly. [00:06:32] First responders. [00:06:33] And I'm sorry, I should have mentioned that, but we do have mutual aid agreements. [00:06:37] That's different than this? [00:06:38] Mutual aid's different than this then? [00:06:41] It is different, but because in a mutual aid agreement, we're providing services to subsidize [00:06:49] the services of the county. [00:06:52] In the case of an interlocal service agreement, we would provide service in lieu of their [00:06:57] service. [00:06:59] We would take number one instead of number two. [00:07:01] That's right. [00:07:02] Okay. [00:07:03] Deputy Mayor? [00:07:04] I guess my question with all this is, has the county or anyone from the county, whether [00:07:08] it be a commissioner or Mr. Biles or anyone from staff, come and ask us for help? [00:07:12] Are they currently having issues with their policing territory around our city with fire [00:07:17] and emergency medical service? [00:07:19] My question is, what brings all this up? [00:07:21] If the county said, hey, you know, we're struggling over around your city, can we give you a little [00:07:25] bit of money out of the taxpayer's pocket and we'll have you guys help us out? [00:07:30] Or are we just trying to kind of throw this on them? [00:07:32] Because I speak to commissioners on a pretty regular basis, and no one's brought this up [00:07:37] to me saying they need help with any of these services. [00:07:39] I understand we sell water and do that aspect of it, but other than that, with public safety, [00:07:44] fire, emergency, I get like Van Doren and Leisure Lane. [00:07:46] We have an interlocal agreement where we both police that area. [00:07:49] It's such a problem area. [00:07:50] But I guess my question and my concern here is, is the county coming to us for help or [00:07:54] are we trying to give them help they're not asking for? [00:07:57] That's kind of where I'm at here with this whole meeting. [00:08:00] I think that's a good question. [00:08:02] Mr. Altman? [00:08:03] If I might answer, I'll tell you how the impetus of this, if you'd like to hear how it began, [00:08:09] began with a research a few years ago when I worked for the city on annexation for the [00:08:16] city manager. [00:08:18] And at the time, there was a sense that we would be able to get into an agreement with [00:08:23] them to annex these areas. [00:08:25] And you all have talked about that during your tenure as well, and had aspired actually [00:08:30] to see us smooth out our boundaries and that sort of thing. [00:08:34] At the time, it was individuals in the planning department that suggested to me that they [00:08:38] were considering an inter-service agreement with Zephyr Hills from a standpoint of planning [00:08:42] and development. [00:08:43] Planning department for the county? [00:08:44] Yeah. [00:08:45] Okay. [00:08:46] And so they referred me to this statute. [00:08:49] I did some research and I saw that it was an alternative to annexation. [00:08:53] So I think the premise of your comments, Councilman, that this is something that you would have [00:08:59] asked for the county, you would have expected the county to come ask us for help. [00:09:04] Right. [00:09:05] They needed help. [00:09:06] I think it's the opposite is the issue, really, which is something I've verbalized a number [00:09:11] of times, which is that we are providing services to an area greater than our city boundaries, [00:09:17] and we have an opportunity to demonstrate to them that we do. [00:09:21] What services are you referring to? [00:09:22] Well, people who come to our recreation center, for example, people that come to our library, [00:09:27] people who need to get out on Main Street where there's flooding through the flooding area. [00:09:36] What I would like, if you're willing, because I think you're coming up right off the bat, [00:09:39] I think with a comment questioning the propriety of even discussing this, I would like if you [00:09:46] would just allow for us to have like a five-minute discussion on each of these areas. [00:09:49] We can have an hour discussion. [00:09:50] I'm okay. [00:09:51] I'm just trying to figure out what premise. [00:09:52] And if we're talking about this agreement with the county, why is there no representatives [00:09:56] from the county even at the meeting here? [00:09:59] It starts with us. [00:10:00] Well, in response, I have had discussions with the county administrator about this issue, [00:10:07] and I advised him that a work session would be convened, but I did not give him a date. [00:10:13] What was his response regarding the topic? [00:10:18] His response to me was that in order to go forward, we would need to have some specific [00:10:25] parameters in terms of the service to be provided and what we would be asking for [00:10:32] in terms of a fee for the service provided. [00:10:36] And believe me, I'm not trying to, if I came across negative, that wasn't my intention. [00:10:40] We all have things that we feel are important, and we try to agenda, and if any of my colleagues [00:10:45] ever have something they want to discuss, I'm not trying to be negative. [00:10:48] I'm 100% behind discussing it. [00:10:50] I'm just trying to figure out, I guess, get a grasp on where this came from and where [00:10:54] we're at, and if the county really needs help, or if we feel like we're helping the [00:10:57] county out already, but we're not getting any payment for it. [00:11:02] That's more like it. [00:11:03] Okay. [00:11:04] Yeah, go ahead. [00:11:05] I was going to say, my thought was if there's some interest on their part, I would certainly [00:11:13] be willing to sit down and talk with them about doing that and covering some of these [00:11:19] areas. [00:11:22] I hate to get too far down the road if the proposal would just be DOA when it hit the [00:11:30] county, so we perhaps, if we're interested in offering our services and the ability of [00:11:38] us to provide those services to some of the surrounding areas, I wonder if floating it [00:11:47] as a trial balloon, if you will, to county staff and saying, hey, here's some areas that [00:11:54] we could provide service, would there be an interest before we get into a whole long project? [00:12:02] So when you say a whole long project, let me just say again that the city's general [00:12:09] fund and the operations of the departments we have in the general fund are critical to [00:12:15] be able to grow and to be able to survive. [00:12:19] As a side note, the CRA discussions we've been having and the idea of extending the [00:12:24] boundaries another 30 years continues to freeze the general fund. [00:12:27] So we have a financial interest in looking at the ability for us to sustain the services [00:12:34] that we're providing. [00:12:35] In fact, I was told by the director of the FRA that it was in fact one of our fire chiefs [00:12:40] back in the day who was leading the fight against CRAs that led to the state legislative [00:12:46] against CRAs. [00:12:47] No longer employed with the city, but there is certainly an understanding that I think [00:12:52] police, fire, general operations, library, recreation has put on a diet when all of our [00:13:00] money from our taxes, from our tax growth, as well as the county's, go into a trust fund [00:13:05] for redevelopment. [00:13:06] And I think there's been over time a lot of even misunderstanding when they see us [00:13:12] building something like fixing a street or doing a street thing when they might have [00:13:17] needs of their own. [00:13:18] So I think the exercise itself is a positive exercise. [00:13:23] As an example, I really want to advocate for us to be able to have ambulances to take our [00:13:28] folks to the hospital at minimum. [00:13:30] You know, I don't know how we negotiated away our rights to do something. [00:13:36] But that forces us to sit down and say, maybe the fire departments talk to each other, see [00:13:41] ways we can better work together that will either allow us to get our own revenue stream [00:13:46] so we can help to grow and manage our departments or otherwise. [00:13:52] And that's the one time I see where county and city, for some reason we can't transport, [00:13:57] correct? [00:13:58] Our fire department? [00:13:59] That's correct. [00:14:00] So if there's a car accident, we send our big truck out, they send their truck out. [00:14:02] To me, that's, out of all this, that's the one time I see over and over again where we're [00:14:07] kind of doubling resources. [00:14:09] And tell me again, I'm sure we've had this discussion, but Chris, if you could tell me [00:14:13] again why we can't transport, because if we, I just kind of see this possibly leading into [00:14:21] a consolidation of our fire department with the county, which is, and possibly police [00:14:25] down the road, which is something I personally don't want. [00:14:28] So I just think we need to be very, very careful here. [00:14:30] But if you could address that and let counsel and anybody watching at home or in the audience [00:14:35] here know why we can't transport, why we have to have a county fire truck or ambulance show [00:14:41] up on top of our fire truck at accidents or on any occasion where somebody's injured and [00:14:47] needs to be transported to a hospital. [00:14:48] It seems like double taxpayer money use, for lack of better terms. [00:14:55] The county controls all transports to medical facilities. [00:15:00] in the county, within Pasco County, so they do all the transports for Zephyrhills and [00:15:05] New Port Richey. [00:15:06] And I can't give you all the specifics on why, but they control that. [00:15:11] Is that a monetary thing? [00:15:13] Is that why they want to control it? [00:15:15] That would have to be a discussion that would start with the city manager, with the county [00:15:18] administrator on trying to get the specifics on allowing us to transport. [00:15:23] Would you be in favor of transporting? [00:15:28] I think it has its advantages, as many as the disadvantages with that, so... [00:15:36] I'm told from discussion with the county administrator, they do subsidize the cost of providing ambulance [00:15:46] service with their general fund, so it is not profit-driven on their part. [00:15:52] I think one of the reasons that in the city it's so important that we do provide EMS service [00:15:59] is that we provide a higher level of service by arriving a little bit quicker than the [00:16:06] county can arrive to our scenes. [00:16:09] And certainly when it comes to the condition being treated, it's generally very helpful [00:16:16] to have someone with their hands on the patient quicker. [00:16:21] I can personally vouch for this. [00:16:23] Last Wednesday night during choir practice, the tenor that was sitting next to me basically [00:16:29] passed out. [00:16:32] Somebody spotted her and pointed her out to the choir director, and I looked over and [00:16:35] she slumped over against the person on her other side. [00:16:40] We called 911, and New Port Richey had their emergency crew there within a couple of minutes. [00:16:48] It was several minutes more before the Pasco County transport unit showed up. [00:16:54] So we have EMTs sitting there working on the victim... [00:16:58] Before the ambulance ever gets there. [00:17:00] So we're helping the victim on site, but we just can't... [00:17:03] I mean, to me, that's a pretty big risk we take. [00:17:07] If we have EMS on scene helping a victim, I would assume sometimes, whether it's a heart [00:17:12] attack or whatnot, the quicker that victim gets to the hospital, the better chances he [00:17:16] or she has on surviving whatever accident they may have incurred. [00:17:21] So if we're treating on scene, but then we're having to wait extra time for a transport [00:17:26] to come, then I could see that being an issue. [00:17:29] If I may respond to some of the questions, in my opinion, the city fire department responds [00:17:39] to city emergencies in a 4.6 square mile radius, and we're there very, very quickly. [00:17:48] As opposed to the county, we can be anywhere in the county at any given time with the rescues. [00:17:54] So we have an average of a four-minute response time to an emergency. [00:18:00] So it's more critical to get a paramedic to the scene within four minutes to decrease [00:18:06] the chance of any brain injuries during a loss of breathing, as opposed to waiting a [00:18:14] few minutes extra for a rescue to get there. [00:18:17] There are some times where we are waiting too long for a rescue to arrive for transport, [00:18:26] but it's more critical to get a paramedic there quick. [00:18:29] Which I would agree, but sometimes on top of that, pretty critical to get someone to [00:18:33] a hospital as quick as possible. [00:18:35] I'm not blaming the county. [00:18:36] We're coming right inside our city limits from our fire stations. [00:18:40] They have a further way to travel, a further distance to travel. [00:18:43] So I mean, out of all this that I'm looking at and I've read about, that's the one issue [00:18:48] that just seems to be stuck in the back of my mind since I've been sitting up here is [00:18:52] that we can't transport and it just doesn't make a lot of sense. [00:18:57] If anybody wants to stay on this topic, I want to pick out another one. [00:18:59] Let me try to at least address what the city manager said about the way the county operates. [00:19:04] The county puts a 1.8 millage rate on fire service. [00:19:11] So for them to say that they have to dip into the general fund to help to operate to subsidize [00:19:15] their ambulance service is understandable because that's not a big millage rate. [00:19:21] But in the city, based on our CRA limits, the fire department, just its operating budget [00:19:27] is equal to about 10 mils. [00:19:30] And so that's a huge number for a small city. [00:19:33] And it's because of all of the effort that we have, Highway 19, and we have a lot of [00:19:37] traffic coming through and we have a lot of accidents that we respond to, they're planning [00:19:41] to build a fire station. [00:19:42] I can't see any reason why it wouldn't be smart for us to sit down and say, if we could [00:19:46] get 1.8 mils out of Gulf Harbors where their houses are valued at three or four or five [00:19:50] times ours, we would have a substantial budget that would come back to our fire department [00:19:56] to outfit all of that. [00:19:58] And particularly if we were able to transport and receive those revenues, it's at least [00:20:02] revenue. [00:20:03] So the fire department doesn't lose money, it costs money. [00:20:07] And so when someone says they subsidize, the county is subsidizing their 1.8 mils with [00:20:13] some additional money to get them there. [00:20:16] But I think that it's worth an analysis, and particularly since they're considering to [00:20:21] build that other fire station out there at the very limited amount. [00:20:27] There's some talk, there's some coordination, which there already is. [00:20:32] But please don't make a mistake, I'm not advocating, and it's easy to jump to the conclusion [00:20:39] that Dunedin, Brooksville, many other communities have given up their fire departments and their [00:20:44] police departments. [00:20:45] That's not what I'm talking about at all. [00:20:47] What I'm talking about is trying to make sure that our departments are properly funded and [00:20:52] we have the ability to function. [00:20:54] This gives us an opportunity to prove to the county areas where we're working. [00:20:58] If we put up a map and put every park or recreation facility in the county, you'll [00:21:03] see that they built around us, and they built separately. [00:21:09] I'm sorry, Chopper, I'm done with fire, so I guess I do have another topic I'm ready [00:21:13] to talk about. [00:21:14] I just want to think, you brought it to my mind, is there a transport at the facility [00:21:22] on Massachusetts or the facility over by the old Kmart? [00:21:25] Yeah. [00:21:26] They have them in both? [00:21:27] Yes. [00:21:28] Yeah. [00:21:29] So if they're not already at a situation, then they're pretty close, once we've stabilized [00:21:37] or got the person, once we've recognized what we need to do with that person that we've [00:21:40] already got there in four minutes, is that correct? [00:21:43] We work very well with the county, and we work daily with them, obviously, on a lot [00:21:48] of scenes, and the station on Massachusetts and the station 19 by the old Kmart does have [00:21:54] transport capabilities if they are in the station, but like I said, they could be out [00:21:58] somewhere else. [00:21:59] Yeah, that's why I was wondering. [00:22:00] I just wanted to make sure they had transport at both places. [00:22:05] The other thing, didn't we battle with the county on roads three or four years ago? [00:22:13] They weren't very happy. [00:22:14] You mean the local option gas tax? [00:22:16] Yeah. [00:22:17] They weren't very happy with working with us on that situation, and that's another one [00:22:20] that you would have, is that, you know, you would talk about interlocal agreement, you [00:22:25] know, or whatever you call this, you know, and it doesn't... [00:22:28] Roads would be an eligible topic, yes. [00:22:30] Yeah, and it seems like they're not, you know, they didn't want to help us on that one to [00:22:34] start with, so... [00:22:35] Well, they have a different council now. [00:22:37] I mean, Commissioner Wells, I met with him. [00:22:40] He's very excited to work with us, and some of the county commissioners have offered to [00:22:47] frequently fund pieces of equipment that aren't used that often, those sorts of things. [00:22:50] I don't see anything wrong that can come from talking, and we don't have to do anything [00:22:54] we don't want to do, so we're not stepping into a process that's going to commit us to [00:22:58] anything other than to say, let's look at these areas and talk to each other and let [00:23:02] the staff and the city manager come back to us with ideas. [00:23:06] Well, that's different than what she presented in the beginning. [00:23:11] She presented we're supposed to put some kind of... [00:23:13] Just a map. [00:23:14] Well, I mean, you know, we know... [00:23:15] I thought it was a resolution. [00:23:16] Resolution and stuff, yeah. [00:23:17] I mean... [00:23:18] What's the resolution that we want to enact this provision of the statutes and put it [00:23:22] into... [00:23:23] Trigger it into motion? [00:23:24] We're going... [00:23:25] I think we're getting a little too far ahead. [00:23:26] I mean, I would like... [00:23:27] You know, let's maybe make a list of, you know, a few things that we'd like him to talk [00:23:32] about and see if we can get any kind of reception before we storm in with this sheet of paper [00:23:36] saying... [00:23:37] We're not storming in. [00:23:38] Well... [00:23:39] They're aware of it. [00:23:40] Okay, we're walking in with this sheet of paper saying, you know, we want to discuss [00:23:43] this, you know? [00:23:44] I mean, I think there's... [00:23:46] I would talk with my friends first before I decided I'd put some paperwork in. [00:23:49] I would agree with Councilman Davis. [00:23:51] I think that's what I was trying to express, maybe not very well the last time, which is [00:23:57] I have no problem with us talking with them and see if there's any interest. [00:24:02] If there is absolutely no interest, then let's not waste our time. [00:24:06] We'll concentrate on some other things. [00:24:07] Or aggravate them. [00:24:08] Or aggravate them. [00:24:09] Yeah. [00:24:10] If there is some interest, yeah, let's pursue it. [00:24:13] Murphy, you've been sitting over there quietly thinking about all this. [00:24:17] What are your thoughts? [00:24:18] Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of things up in the air we need to know. [00:24:22] I think I'd like to maybe start with the department heads and stuff and get their thoughts on [00:24:27] what would make sense or not make sense to them and their areas. [00:24:31] I mean, if they have capacity, are we going to have to hire more people? [00:24:34] Will those fees from the county be able to subsidize those people? [00:24:37] I mean, there's a lot of things we need to talk about, but I'd probably like to hear [00:24:41] from them. [00:24:42] I don't know if they're here tonight, but if they have some ideas in their department [00:24:46] how it would benefit or not benefit them, I think that would be a good idea to maybe [00:24:50] start there and kind of move forward from that direction. [00:24:54] I would agree. [00:24:55] I mean, let's just engage them verbally and maybe have a joint meeting to discuss it. [00:25:02] A resolution just sounds so official to me. [00:25:05] Like, you know, this is Newport City Council's resolution that we want to, you know. [00:25:10] Now, if the verbal discussions go well and they want to pursue this, and legally at that [00:25:17] point we have to draft a resolution to proceed, then I'm okay with that. [00:25:21] There's things I'm looking at in here that, you know, I would love to get help from the [00:25:25] county, but it's not going to happen. [00:25:27] The one thing that sticks out to me is conservation, parks, and recreation. [00:25:31] I wish I had the numbers in front of me because I was pushing really, really, really hard [00:25:34] for, what was it, local, what was it, muni, I can't think of the term right now. [00:25:41] To generate the funds, the proposal they had for parks and rec on a county basis. [00:25:45] Municipal. [00:25:46] Municipal, something, where it went, would have gone to referendum, but the county commissioners [00:25:54] themselves had the power to impose that without it going to referendum for parks and rec, [00:26:00] and they did not do so, and now what they put on the ballot for referendum is just to [00:26:04] get us caught up with maintenance. [00:26:06] Our county grew by 10 percent, I think, in the last five to six years, and we're not [00:26:10] building district parks that even come close to what our surrounding counties and counties [00:26:17] throughout the state have, and we're growing at a much faster pace than them, so yes, county [00:26:23] residents come and use our parks, they use our boat ramp on a regular basis. [00:26:28] Would I like to see some money from parks and rec from the county to help us maintain [00:26:32] and maybe expand when need be, absolutely, but there's no funding there, period. [00:26:36] It's not a priority to the current commissioners, period. [00:26:39] I went and spoke to them, it's not. [00:26:41] So the Bonner referendum is, once again, just to get us back up where people aren't getting [00:26:45] electrocuted trying to turn the lights on at the soccer fields and baseball fields in [00:26:49] Dade City. [00:26:51] We are that far behind, but to toot our own horn, I'm glad the city has elected to take [00:26:57] the path that we've taken and putting the funding needed into our parks and recreation [00:27:04] to promote the lifestyle and atmosphere we're looking to promote for our current residents [00:27:10] and residents we're trying to recruit to move into our city. [00:27:13] But like I said, the public safety, maybe with the fire, they might be off to discuss [00:27:18] in that, but a few of these, I'm just thinking, we won't know until they come back to us verbally, [00:27:24] but it's just one of those things. [00:27:27] We put a lot of money in our parks and library and we share it with people who don't live [00:27:29] in our city limits and pay city taxes. [00:27:32] I just don't know how to get around that though. [00:27:33] Well, you have to add to your parks and recreation, they gave us back plumber fields, you know, [00:27:39] they wanted out of them. [00:27:40] Yeah, they don't want to maintain that. [00:27:42] If you all would, I heard all four of you, I heard your intentions. [00:27:47] We still haven't talked about each one of these areas. [00:27:49] If you wouldn't mind, I'd like to at least touch on the areas and give you my feelings [00:27:53] because frankly, we are the policy makers and the county commission are the policy makers [00:27:58] and I know that Commissioner Wells made it clear to the county administrator that he [00:28:03] expects to exercise his role as a policy maker. [00:28:06] So I'm perfectly happy for us to follow the path that the four of you have suggested. [00:28:13] Let's talk to them and be friendly. [00:28:15] I never really intended for this to be interpreted as anything but that, but when we had our [00:28:21] joint meeting, we got that little warning from a couple of county commissioners not [00:28:25] to use our CRA because it wasn't going to be around too long and there are probably [00:28:30] still among the staff, because I did serve as a county commissioner at the time and I [00:28:35] listened to that staff for four years talk about things like the city didn't have a transportation [00:28:40] impact fee. [00:28:41] Well, the city hasn't grown, we were still 15,000 people then and we are now. [00:28:45] So the transportation impact fee didn't really apply to us when we were being encapsulated [00:28:51] by a larger county. [00:28:53] So if you would, just let me take a few minutes because we do have it before our 7 o'clock [00:28:56] meeting and just go over these one at a time with my feelings of at least topics for these [00:29:03] different departments to talk to each other on. [00:29:06] So obviously fire, transport, possible service area that would allow us to handle an area [00:29:18] that might be financially beneficial and assist us to handle. [00:29:23] Could we put that map up too that we have just out of curiosity? [00:29:28] But going on to the next one, in that map, all of the areas in blue, light blue, represent [00:29:37] the existing service, Maytum Chambers service area agreement that we have for our water [00:29:42] and sewer. [00:29:44] And just by example of that, I think we could have Robert repeat his commentary before, [00:29:51] but he sees potential growth for the city to the east and I see the potential of that [00:29:57] small blue lower left. [00:30:00] That blue slot there on Trouble Creek, where Robert has told me, we generally often see in high rain events and smell the sewage from the septics in that community there. [00:30:14] That access is the Gulf, and to me, there's some environmental benefits for us being able to do those areas. [00:30:21] If we had full service area authority, we could go in there, go to Swift Mud, get maybe some grants to put some stuff in there, put sewer in there, and under Florida statutes, we could do it. [00:30:37] The county and their powers choose not to do that unless people want it. [00:30:43] To me, that's an environmental area. [00:30:45] The area in yellow is an area that kind of, I think, maybe mimics the boundaries that the city manager had suggested to us could be ultimate long-term municipal boundaries. [00:30:58] Yellow to the east or west? [00:30:59] All of that yellow. [00:31:00] You know, Trouble Creek, maybe little is a bit beyond what the county would consider, but Gulf of Mexico to the west. [00:31:09] So if we were to submit a map, in my view, it would be let's talk about these areas, county, what you're doing there, what we do there, and how we can best serve those residents. [00:31:22] That's the simple, that's just a simple approach. [00:31:26] How do we best serve the people that are in there? [00:31:28] Whether it's getting them to the hospital quickest or, you know, we could probably get people to the hospital quicker from Gulf Harbors if our, because we have, you know, a more ready and a well-equipped and manned operation than the county does on them geographically. [00:31:46] So if you look at stormwater then, and we look at all that light blue that's out to the Gulf, the county charges a stormwater fee, and they collect it. [00:31:58] And so they must have a stormwater plan. [00:32:01] And so why doesn't the county stormwater plan include fixing up the evacuation route and working with us on a joint problem we have of drainage on Main Street? [00:32:15] It services a lot more people than us. [00:32:17] So really the idea is looking at everybody that lives in there and say, how are they best served? [00:32:22] Coming back, talking, and then we can reject or accept any potential solutions that the staff come to. [00:32:29] The formal process doesn't have to occur. [00:32:31] I mean, it can be done in a friendly basis, and I'm all for it if that's, you know, if you think that's going to be a more acceptable way. [00:32:39] But if those assessments were collected and given back to the city, then Robert could actually work to determine a stormwater plan that would best help us to control flooding but also do the right environmental thing. [00:32:59] At Gulf Harbors and at Southgate Shopping Center, that little area in blue there is the Southgate Shopping Area. [00:33:06] The water that comes from the east side of Highway 19 goes through there and back to the apartments, I believe, behind Southgate, and then we lose track of it. [00:33:16] And they're flooding, and there's arguments and pointing fingers back at each other as to whose fault whatever is. [00:33:24] These areas also are an agreement, can include an agreement, that if those areas change hands or if whatever legal area there is that the county would not object to our annexation of those areas. [00:33:35] So we do get one good thing out of it if we can get it, which is an agreement that this is our urban area of our city. [00:33:43] If you go to, so stormwater, I think, is an important one. [00:33:48] The utility plan, as well in the light blue, we had all that discussion last week about Gulf Harbors. [00:33:54] I think we need to continue that discussion. [00:33:57] Do they really need the $9 million of improvement to their collection system? [00:34:01] Are they going to do it? [00:34:03] How does our plant size up and getting the two departments to talk together and come up with a plan that would allow us to develop our own growth plan within the boundaries of the capacity of our sewer plant is important for us from a planning standpoint. [00:34:20] From a planning standpoint, the harbors is an area where tax increment financing we're using for our CRA is something the county commissioners have told me they're considering in the county. [00:34:33] So if they're planning a CRA plan within that area, then to do improvements to Highway 19 and a lot of areas on 19 are not in the city, then we should coordinate that effort. [00:34:48] Councilwoman Starkey, or Commissioner Starkey, has indicated her wish that our signage and our look of our highway matched up their signage. [00:34:58] I think if you look closely, we should see our sign ordinance causes has a lot of height restrictions in it and is already pretty good. [00:35:06] But I just I don't know. [00:35:09] I hear about what the county won't want or won't let us do or the fighting. [00:35:14] And I think it's critical as we do our CRA plan to have a good relationship with them so that if we do take a large chunk of our city and increase the CRA for another 30 years, [00:35:26] we've got to have a plan to keep our fire and our police departments functioning. [00:35:30] I mean, it was even though one might be anxious that our fire chief at the time argued against CRA legislation because he was worried that it would cut off the funding growth to the general fund, [00:35:44] which is what I hear from the director of the Florida Redevelopment Association. [00:35:49] We need to face the reality that 30 years of keeping our taxable property tax at $370 million is going to restrict the growth of these departments in our city. [00:36:02] If this if the county is OK with our CRA plan and they see what we're doing just by demonstrating to them all of the services we provide and coordinating our efforts and even our five year plan with them, [00:36:15] they'd be on board with us and we wouldn't have them, you know, resisting. [00:36:21] So I believe we could achieve a partnership with the county at a policy level. [00:36:27] And I'm happy to see the county departments and the city departments talk to each other, but I'm not so sure that the outcome will be any different, [00:36:34] Chopper, than what it has been in the past, which is territorial or, as they say, silo oriented. [00:36:40] So I think it's incumbent on the leadership of the city and the county to say, you know, [00:36:45] please make a good effort at this and not just go ask you what you would like or how you feel, because it's only natural that we're all territorial. [00:36:56] To the library, as example, again, you know, the independence of our library is important. [00:37:04] I asked for and tried to understand the agreement, the joint agreement that Zephyr Hills has, where they actually place a few of their employees in the Zephyr Hills library. [00:37:13] I really still don't have a good understanding of that, but it wouldn't take much to send the library back and say, how does you know, you've got all this money. [00:37:23] We've got improvements we want to make. [00:37:25] We're open to everybody. [00:37:26] We don't charge anybody anything. [00:37:28] We function at a level as good or better than the county. [00:37:32] So, you know, how about us working together, providing us with some money. [00:37:39] Whether it's the New Port Richey and the New Port Richey merger, because I was around when we had that talk about the efficiency of a merger between the cities. [00:37:47] It was, just speaking bluntly, it was the department heads in New Port Richey that felt that New Port Richey was bigger and would gobble them up. [00:37:56] And that had influence on the city council at the time to say effectively, hell no, we're not interested and be unhappy. [00:38:06] So working towards the best interest of the citizens requires some direction, I think, from us. [00:38:15] And whether you pass to ask for a resolution or not, whether it's library, parks and recreation, [00:38:25] we jointly own Green Key Beach. [00:38:28] Commissioner Mariano suggested he wants to see revenues going out to Green Key Beach, fixing up the road. [00:38:36] He wants to kind of redirect the same thing they did to Hudson Avenue out to Green Key Beach. [00:38:41] We'll see. [00:38:42] But bottom line. [00:38:43] If you wanted that, if anyone on the county wanted that, they would have pushed for a higher bond issue for the parks and rec in this November ballot. [00:38:50] So I see more of you take it because we can't afford to maintain it anymore, just like Plummer Field on that issue. [00:38:57] Well, and if that's the case, we have a ready, willing and able departments that are out there able to handle that. [00:39:04] And so that simple discussion could be had. [00:39:07] I mean, if we took over, for example, the Gulf of the Green Key Beach, we would need revenue to help us because they put sand on it. [00:39:18] They've got capital improvements and they would have we would have to ask them to commit resources. [00:39:24] So it's like who's who's in the front, who's driving that particular service and who's paying for that service. [00:39:32] But there are examples all across the state of intergovernmental cooperation. [00:39:37] That has not been the history here ever since our city manager left to become county administrator some 40 some years ago and [00:39:45] dropped his double taxation talk and all of a sudden became, you know, [00:39:53] more loyal to the county position that he that he was in. [00:39:57] And I've I've talked to Mr. Gallagher many times about that position. [00:40:04] We're a small city of 15,000. [00:40:07] We're trying to have a downtown for one hundred thousand people and be the host of these big events. [00:40:15] I think it's only fair for us to ask the county, if you're really serious about this harvest plan and you really want something to happen, [00:40:22] let's sit down and figure out how we can do it because I haven't seen much action on on on their part in terms of implementing this plan. [00:40:31] They won big awards for it. [00:40:34] And if nothing else, they could see our CRA plan and say, you know what? [00:40:37] You guys are on top of it. [00:40:39] We've decided this is the area that needs to start. [00:40:41] We'll get off your back on the CRA. [00:40:44] If nothing else, if the results of this, you know, interaction backs them off of trying to resist our use of CRA dollars, [00:40:54] that's that's been our you know, that's been our way to make capital improvements in the city. [00:41:00] So I would like to have some kind of sense that we would dispatch our county administrator to the county city manager, [00:41:09] to the county administrator, to ask them to develop maybe some conceptual ideas of how we might work together, [00:41:15] bring them back to us and then maybe go through this process. [00:41:19] But the only way to go through the process is to start with a resolution, [00:41:22] whether it's us or them, when we decide that there's some merit for it. [00:41:27] And I will just back to Robert K. [00:41:29] Reese, Morrill Park. [00:41:30] There has been discussions with the county as far as us taking over, whether it's through a sale or a gift to us. [00:41:36] But I did have a private discussion with Ms. [00:41:39] Mann's just to let her know my concerns there. [00:41:42] It used to be a really, really beautiful place. [00:41:45] It still is beautiful. [00:41:46] I had my wedding pictures there 15 years ago. [00:41:48] It's how nice it was with the sea urchins and everything. [00:41:50] They used to bring in beach sand on a regular basis. [00:41:52] They used to put money into that park. [00:41:54] They flat have not had the money to do it for a long time. [00:41:58] And it shows. [00:41:59] So I'm not opposed to tying that into our city down the road during with discussions if we are able to maintain it. [00:42:06] Because that's my biggest pet peeve, as Robert knows, with landscaping, with anything. [00:42:09] Don't build or buy something unless you can afford to maintain it. [00:42:12] So just on that one specific topic, if they say, well, we want to give it to you. [00:42:17] We want you to take it over and just charge you this amount. [00:42:20] If it comes to that, I'm not opposed to it. [00:42:23] I just want to make sure we as a city have the resources to maintain that beautiful Gulffront Park the way it should be. [00:42:31] That's my only concern there with that one. [00:42:32] They spent a lot of money on Honeymoon Island in the last couple of years. [00:42:36] If I could ask, just on that one specific part, if I could ask Debbie to respond. [00:42:41] Because I think it looks, Debbie, as if the direction comes back to you to further that. [00:42:49] In order for us to have a reasonable discussion, it would cause, for example, [00:42:53] each one of the departments involved to just do a little summary review of our services versus county services, where theirs are. [00:43:03] As an example, with Elaine, for example, there are a certain fixed number of recreation centers around the county. [00:43:10] And just simply plotting them on the map, it's pretty clear to me that the county did not design a center right near ours. [00:43:18] Because we have a great center, and it's well used, and the need isn't there. [00:43:22] When it comes to the fire department, they've got one out on 19 behind the K-Mart. [00:43:27] And if the bond issue passes, that's one of the ones they intend to expand and grow into with a four-station bay and to do more transit. [00:43:40] And if that's the case, then how does that pair up with our capital improvement plan that we have? [00:43:47] And how, I saw recently a news article about their ladder companies, I don't know if you saw that, Chief, or not, [00:43:54] but how they've got, like, trained ladder companies, and we're talking about buying a new ladder truck. [00:43:59] So how does our ladder truck usage and storage and what are their needs and what are ours? [00:44:07] So they're dead set in the middle of our city with a large station expansion plan that causes me to question if they're going to buy a ladder truck [00:44:21] and we have a mutual aid agreement, whether we should spend $800,000 on a ladder truck. [00:44:26] I appreciate that we have one, and we'd like to drive it if we need to get somewhere. [00:44:31] But I think a realistic look at where the needs are and what our solutions is. [00:44:37] I don't know how all of the department heads even interact, I'm assuming, well with the department heads at the county. [00:44:43] I haven't heard any complaints. [00:44:45] I think our department heads go through our city manager. [00:44:47] I don't think they reach out to the county directly, do they? [00:44:50] They do reach out to a limited degree to their counterparts in the county. [00:44:57] And I have to say from what I [00:45:00] know that we have a very [00:45:01] cooperative relationship with all of the departments in the county. [00:45:05] Good, they have their leeway to do that then. [00:45:07] Well, let me just sum up what I've heard a little bit here. [00:45:11] You know, from what I gather, [00:45:13] we'd like you to, Debbie, we'd [00:45:15] like you to talk to your [00:45:16] department head, see if there's [00:45:17] a place where that, you know, [00:45:18] your departments might match with [00:45:20] what the county's doing and report [00:45:22] back to us maybe on a [00:45:23] Friday, or maybe on a [00:45:25] council meeting where you think [00:45:26] that we might sit down and talk with the county. [00:45:29] Does that sound, yeah, does that sound good? [00:45:33] I understand my marching orders. [00:45:35] Okay, super. [00:45:38] Do you have any suggestions otherwise, or other alternatives, Debbie, or does that make sense to you? [00:45:44] Well, we covered a good number of them tonight. [00:45:46] Yeah. [00:45:47] And I'll make sure that they're [00:45:48] part of what the department [00:45:50] heads take into consideration and we bring back to you. [00:45:54] Mr. Murphy, any other, oh goodness, that sounds good. [00:45:56] Mr. Altman? [00:45:57] No, only to say that I've [00:45:59] spoken to four of the five [00:46:00] county commissioners and they're all [00:46:02] welcoming the idea that [00:46:03] we can look at ways to work together. [00:46:09] Maybe, I don't know that there's anything different anybody else is hearing, but [00:46:13] with our national situation where [00:46:15] there's just so much hectic [00:46:21] and troubling lack of cooperation, [00:46:23] I think that there's a real [00:46:24] opportunity now for both us [00:46:26] and the city, and the [00:46:28] county to try to [00:46:30] find ways we can help each other. [00:46:31] And we've been doing it informally. [00:46:34] It'd be nice if we could get [00:46:35] recognized for some of what we do and come up with some revenue. [00:46:38] Do we have any scheduled [00:46:42] dates in the near future [00:46:44] for our next Westside meeting with New Port Richey and the county? [00:46:48] We do not have a scheduled meeting at this time. [00:46:51] Okay, if you could talk to, if that's all right with you, I'll talk to Mr. [00:46:53] Biles about that as well, because we [00:46:55] had that last meeting several months ago. [00:46:56] We kind of all agreed, well, this is great. [00:46:58] We really, you know, hashing things out here. [00:47:00] Let's start doing this on a regular basis. [00:47:01] And then, I haven't heard of any. [00:47:04] I was told that they'd consider that an annual event. [00:47:07] Annual, I'd like to meet more than once a year. [00:47:09] Well, that was what I [00:47:10] heard from the county, but I [00:47:12] think more than that, I think [00:47:13] this is a city of New Port Richey and county issue. [00:47:16] I don't know that there's [00:47:18] any benefit at this point in [00:47:19] us trying to bring the third party into this. [00:47:21] No, I'm not trying to bring a third party. [00:47:23] My point being that everyone [00:47:25] has a pretty rigorous schedule, [00:47:27] especially commissioners and some are campaigning right now. [00:47:30] If we're all going to be at the table already, maybe. [00:47:33] It's just one of the things we could [00:47:34] bring up while we have our time there to speak to them. [00:47:38] I'm sure the city of New Port Richey has [00:47:39] their concerns and prioritize [00:47:43] things to discuss as well. [00:47:44] But if we're already at the [00:47:46] table, maybe while we're there, we could bring this into work. [00:47:49] So you can plead your case, [00:47:51] you know, in front of all [00:47:52] the commissioners and ourselves, all at one forum. [00:47:57] So, I mean, if they're [00:47:58] willing to have a west side [00:47:59] meeting with New Port Richey and then another [00:48:00] meeting with us, I just, schedule-wise, [00:48:02] it's always tough to get so [00:48:04] many people together, is my point I was making. [00:48:06] It isn't going to happen until after [00:48:07] the election, and probably [00:48:09] not until after Christmas, given that. [00:48:12] Well, I do plan to see [00:48:13] the county administrator on Monday, [00:48:14] so I will ask him about that when we're together. [00:48:17] Yeah, approach it. [00:48:18] Councilman Davis, any other thoughts? [00:48:21] I think we've had a productive discussion, kicking it around. [00:48:27] There is definitely some opportunities for [00:48:28] us to work cooperatively with the county.

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3. 3Adjournment▶ 48:33